V-tech- Over all positive or negative?

The massive surge of power made possible by VTEC is just too much for riders of inferior bikes to handle. :biggrin:

I'm laughing... with you (mostly).

 

I had to delete my last message, I took my pills and now I'm OK :biggrin:

 

I totally agree with you........current vfr challenges me i cant ride it at its full potential. If i need to go 160 +mph i would consider a sprint but i dont see any need to go that fast now or in the future. i think most vfr owners are over that they don't need to own the fast-es bike if that was the case we would all own a bussa .
I am surprised honda didn't come out with a new gen 7 this year , i would of thought after the RWB 25yr anniversary that would of bin a good time to make a change. with all the bad feeling with the bad Vtec they should drop it and add 200 more cc seems it would sell better but personally i dont need the extra ponies

 

I just don't understand why some riders criticize other riders' choices of bikes. Maybe my 4 year-old son can explain it to me . . . .

 

Sounds like object (yeah, you know what I'm talking about Willis) envy to me. Before buying my 05 vtech I asked several owners what their thoughts were and if they would buy it again. The answer was a resounding yes, 100% of the time. Before purchasing any ride (car, truck, bike etc...) I research by asking owners for their opinion, any negative feedback sends me into deeper research. That said, it is all a matter of personal desire and the ability to pay for it. In the next week or two I'll be adding to my stable an 07 FJR for longer two up rides. The wife wants to go up the coast with me the next time I do it. The VFR is my first choice one up. Need more space for two. My .02.

 

Unless your 4 year-old son can recoginze and understand why a dog pisses on every bush in the yard, he probably won't have an answer for you. It is really just an underlying elitist mentality or the need to demonstrate a supposed, superior grasp of knowledge that no one else could possibly hope to attain. Experience doesn't always equal wisdom.

 

OK, I'll buy into this. Why not right?
Both versions have their merit - otherwise Honda would not continue selling them. Honda have always used the VFR as a showcase for their latest technology - good and not so good. I believe the VTEC is Honda's way of demonstrating its technical superiority to the world. In the real world of riding motorbikes however, VTEC is really Honda solving a problem that never existed. Low down torque on two valves and top end on 4. So which VFR was short of low end punch? And if it was, you solve that problem by making it a VFR1000.
The VTEC engine makes the VFR a technology showcase and a damn fine bike to boot.
Personally I prefer the sound of my gen 5 gear drive cam with an Akrapovic race can for audio enhancement.
Both generations are awesome bikes - Honda do that. Ones not 'better' than the other - they are different, and thank goodness, so are the people who purchase them. But I would love to see a sport version - light weight 1000cc gear driven cam V4. Designed to take on the Superbike world. Now that would have my attention big time!
:wink:

 

I would like to see that too as long as it was offered as a completely new model that did not replace the existing VFR. The two bikes would not satisfy the needs of the same crowd.

 

that would be interesting, i have to wonder if theres room for CBR and a v4 super bike ...wonder which one one would sell better

with stewartj on this one would still need to keep a vfr sport tour

 

I guess what I'm worried about most lately is Honda's lack of innovation of late. When the first V-four Hondas came out in '83 they were a revelation. I didn't even ride or have interest in motorcycles at the time and I heard about it everywhere. Same thing for the first Hurricane, not innovative from a technology point of view, but very innovative from a total design point of view; there was nothing else at the time with that chassis and that motor. Honda was making wild stuff like VFRs, VF500Fs, Hurricanes, RVF race bikes, using single sided swingarms, remember how exciting that time was? Remember the first time we saw the NR750? Wow! Amazing, two con rods, 8 valves per oval cylinder??? Wild stuff! Some of it worked, some didn't, but they had cojones, man! They sure kept the other manufacturers going nuts with their innovations.

But lately, all I see are what are referred to in the manufacturing sense as "line extensions"...they take a basic design and do evolutionary changes.
Why is this? Honda appears to be afraid of taking chances anymore.
Sure, there have been some small innovations like Unit Pro-Link and VTEC, but these are small to the much more all-encompassing innovations that Honda used to do with the entire bike.

Especially American Honda....why do we have a grand total of three sportbikes for sale when smaller countries like Australia, Canada, and the UK have, at a minimum, twice as many? None of those countries even has the number of riders in California, yet they have a notably larger selection of bikes from which to choose. I've been discussing this with the owners of my local Honda dealership, and their view is that some of the senior mgt. at American Honda is now close to retirement, and they are just playing it safe, and afraid to take any chances by introducing newer or innovative models. Moreover, they're not pushing back in Honda Japan to make more innovative models. They are convinced that if Honda made a CBR1000RR replacement that was a V-Five derivative of the MotoGP bike, put it in a appropriate RR-type chassis, and charged $15,000 for it, and marketed it as being a direct descendant of their MotoGP race bike, they would have people lining up out the door to put down their money.

My thought is, Honda could do both, create a full-on, V-multi based sport bike for the hard core crowd, and take the same motor, retune it for real-world, low to mid-range torque, put it in a VFR-based chassis with real, world, all-day ergos, and sell it to a completely different market segment. The segment that wants a bike that was heralded for 20 years as the best all-round bike on the planet. This is what Triumph does, and has apparently captured a significant share of the VFR market as a result with the Sprint ST.

So, I'm worried....Honda used to be FEARLESS. I think it was because Soichiro was fearless, and he drove that attribute down through the organization; managers and design teams were valued for being fearless. Now, I don't think that sensibility is there at Honda, certainly not the extent that it used to be. If it is, I ain't seein' it; at least what meets MY sensibility of being fearless.

As someone said on this forum, perhaps here or in another post...the Old Man must be spinning in his grave.

Okay, flame on....:biggrin:

 

Give it a little time. I think NorcalBoy might still be sleeping.

 

that surprise me with US being the biggest market. In canada we have pretty much the same lineup just at up to 30% more cost we have to pay that much extra for french instruction manual and a speedo in kph Honda Canada has a big push on right now to stop Canadians from buying in US. My bikes from US and I'm just one of many. Honda US offers a much larger line up in the ATV world across the line. Canadians tend to be envious of your better selection and pricing
good to see we moved off VTEC:lever:

 

No, I'm here lurking. I don't think that it's worth the effort to have a friendly argument with anybody, concerning the innovations from any of the Big 3 over the last coupla' years. Mass centralization, fly by wire throttles, traction control, bold new graphics, minimalist fairing designs and the ugliest group of production exhausts I think I have ever seen, just doesn't warrant any effort. If you look at the bikes for '08 that are truly new models, what the hell is there to get excited about? Feel free to enlighten me, as I'm quite bored today and the weather sucks.:yawn:

BTW: Come on Stewart you know you want to put on the gloves and headgear and go a few rounds, dontcha' ?

 

I think your right. But I also think the market isn't as good in regards to the freedom that they had to create. Honda can't just up and redesign everything and come out with radical new bikes. People will freak out and run away, look whats happening here. Seems as though Honda adds a big ticket item into an already stable platform and lets people adjust. I think if you look at the 6th gen you will notice that it already is a quite a departure from normality. With indicators that are fully integrated into the fairings, to the VTEC, to the insanely beautiful exhaust, headlights that rival most cars and also the overt styling. Yet it still looks like a bike. I don't think it's NR750 time yet, nor do I think they wanna go down that road again. It's not a matter of them producing the one really cool bike that a "few" have an idea for. It's not gonna happen, they have a business to run. They will build and create what they feel the market will accept.

All the new stuff is old.

VTEC ROCKS! :mullet:

 

My sentiments exactly. Just wish the Big 3 were listening.

 

Jason, I agree with you on the attributes of the 6th gen VFR, but personally, I don't consider it particularly innovative; not in the sense of the breakthrough that the original VF750F was when it came out. Or even the original CBR600, let alone bikes like the RC30, RVF, NR750, VF500F, RC45, or the '86 VFR.

 

I'm with you NorcalBoy. I have been scouring the websites of the manufacturers looking for something new that gets the juices going but am constantly dissappointed. They have all lost the plot on exhausts. The new CB1000R looks the best Honda I have seen in years and the Tuono will likely be my next choice of bike (the worlds best V twin with - wait for it - normal exhausts y' can see!). I don't think I will ever get rid of my Gen 5 tho. Nothing else makes a sound like it and it is just so versatile. For an overweight plonker it sure surprises the heck out of these young hotshots on their Gixxer thou's in the twisties.

 

The Tuono has proven to be quite the weapon. This fact was demonstrated throughout the Sun Trust Moto-ST series in the USA last year. The only downside would be the parts availablity issue with Aprilia. I went through that crap and will never buy another Aprilia as long as I live. However, I'm not going to tell someone else not to buy one.

 

Well from what I heard 07 is the last of the VFR'S.It seems that a new VFR-VCM (Variable Cylinder Management)will be produced.Some say they might be exchanging it for a V-4 GP style bike. I here sometime in late 07 early 08. I guess we'll justhave to wait and see.