Trail Braking Defined

I see a number of people talking about trail braking and it doesn't sound like the right description. Here are words on the subject from Keith Code. He is the shizzle when it comes to knowing how to teach the art of riding FAST!

Given what Keith says, I don't see how linked brakes are a problem for trail braking. If you like to ride the rear to trail brake, then that is one style. You could just as easily learn to trail brake with LBS. The new S1000RR they use at the Superbike school has LBS and they don't recommend having it on or off. They leave it up to the student. If you have properly gauged your entry speed, then you can let off smoothly and trail brake with either separate or linked brakes. If you like to back your bike into the corners like a MotoGP rider, then you are riding WAY too fast on the street. Take it to the track ya speed monkey.

Jose

 

Ya mean like this?

Google Image Result for http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/327/1974louisvillekyrexbeaurt0.jpg

 

I don't really see any 'definition' in the above explanation. From what I read above, trail braking = "getting the speed correct for any given corner".

However, I have seen many vids and heard people explain it as = "using the brakes to change the distance of wheel base so a bike can corner more sharply". The 'trail' part refers to getting your 'trailing tire' a little bit closer to front tire.

Interesting stuff from Keith.

 

Trail braking refers to keeping the front brake on well into the corner, all of the way to the apex. The idea is that you need to gradually let off the brakes as you dip into the corner. When straight up you have 0% lean and 100% brakes. When you are at 25% lean you should be backed off to 75% brakes, and so on. Once you reach 99% of your lean angle you will still have that residual 1% of brakes being applied, or "being trailed" if you will. That's the definition. Think of in terms of fork travel. When you squeeze the brakes the forks will compress. The average rider then backs off the brakes, letting the forks rebound, then enter the turn which puts cornering loads into the forks thus compressing them again. This is what I call a pogo-stick corner entry. Watch closely and I think you will find that most people ride this way, on the street at least.

What I think DaHose is referring to is that people think trail braking means to panic stop too late into a corner. That's also not good.

 

great way to tuck the front when you whiskey throttle it into a corner and then realize that you're in too deep and carrying too much speed.



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Trail braking is a motorcycle riding and driving technique where the brakes are used beyond the entrance to a turn and are gradually released up to the point of apex.

Trailing off the braking pressure either while straight line braking or, as above, after turn in has begun, allows for a less abrupt and more accurate final corner entry speed adjustment. Some corner entries, such as decreasing radius turns, are more adapted to the leaned over trail braking technique. In turns where a quicker steering action is more applicable, trailing the brake while turning in is unnecessary.

 

I like my explanation better. Ha!

 

With who knows how many page of trail braking there are on Google? (i quit at 10) This may become the longest thread on this BB by the time everyone copys the stuff from Google and pastes in up like it was thier own version.

 

Well, this thread certainly is not growing exponentially Billy and no one seems to be claiming any new technique or idea as their own. I only created this thread because I saw another thread (recently) mention trail braking and not describe it correctly. Then the thread "demonized" (such a grand word) the LBS on a VFR based on that misconception. I just wanted to have one, simple thread that very clearly states what trail braking is.

There is absolutely a definition of trail braking in the Keith Code quote and it is in agreement with what Freddie Spencer has written. So many folks around here talk about "Fast Freddie", but don't mention that what made him fast (and smooth) was his proper use of trail braking.

Very simply put, the idea that just using your rear brake independently in a turn = trail braking is wrong. Trail braking is the process of smoothly and progressively letting off the brake lever pressure throughout your turn, which allows for smooth transition back onto the throttle. You should also understand that the most important contributing factor for successful trail braking is properly gauging entry speed.

In top tier motorcycle road racing they don't use the rear brake AT ALL during MOST of the race.

The simple and clear thing I want to point out is that when you understand what trail braking is, you understand that having or not having LBS doesn't matter in the discussion. If you don't like LBS that is just your preference, but anyone CAN trail brake just fine with LBS on a VFR and you will ride smoother/faster if you learn to trail brake on whatever street motorcycle you ride.

Jose

 

Well don't take the lack of participation wrong Jose. Trail Braking is a pretty advanced technique. The explanations by Nick Ianetch (SP?) are correct but it wasn't until two riders I know who have gone through the old Spencer school and Yamaha Champion School pulled me aside at the track and had me do it on the TZ. Its been kind of brought up, the major misconception is you grab some big handful of brake as you are going into the turn or during turn in, WRONG! Yeah you might do that if the bike is straight up and down, but the actual trail brake pressure on the TZ at least is really light. Its weird.

I am still learning it and its the oddest skill I have ever tried to learn.

Lastly, you probably aren't receiving many responses because the sad truth is most riders really don't care about learning new skills or getting better at riding.

BZ

 

That's the way I learned it. Get your entry speed correct by getting all your braking done before the corner. Then enter the corner with throttle on just enough to maintain your speed. Then IF you need a correction you can either do it with a light touch of throttle or front brake. Back then we never used the rear brake. Matter of fact after tech we would roll the rear brake adjustment out to be able to only create drag , no real braking power.

Now that's not to say we (I) didn't use trail braking at times, which I did. Though it was because we didn't enter the corner properly or we dove in to try and capture the position. Which in it's self will not get/keep you on the "perfect" line for the corner. It was just a tool, actually a feel, to use at times, whether I screwed up or planned it. Though I never really used it for regularly taking corners, because it would upset my line more than not.

Today I hear more guys wanting to know how to trail brake, just like dragging a "knee". When they should be learning how to properly take a corner, properly learn how to use throttle and properly learn how to use brakes. Smoothness is the only way to go fast all the time. The less you upset the bike the faster you can go, of course to a certain extent. To fast in can be detrimental to your speed out. The first one in may be the slowest out.

 

About the only thing on this particular BB that grows exponentially is a few waistlines and nocalboy's latest brags.

Yep. Keith Code is on record. Never actually seen what Freddie Spencer said other than some allusions to what he said.

Getting all crunch crotchy about LBS is sorta like dudes who get all shoved out of shape about the way BMW's jack in the corners.

I don't know about who is or was a top tier racer here. I know I wasn't. You? Those guys scare me just seeing them on the tracks or on TV.

Maybe take a looksee at the various ways the technique is explained by other using any search engine. There is a shit load of difference in the way most subjects can be delineated. For instance a "how to" session for a bunch of 7th graders as opposed to a grad school level lecture.

One example that fits using some photo technology. Yep, everyone with a camera is a pnotographer.. LOL

Pop for a pretty good DSLR especially Nikons, some Canons, and even including the new Leica M @ 7K ea.. that allow use of an older lens and the rule of thumb is to multply the focal length (s) by 1.4-1.5.. Good stuff. The actual formula is available probably to three decimals. All ya need is a graphing calculator to get the actual real focal length but by that time, little Tad or Muffy has crapped thier pants and a are all smelly and bawling and the wife is pissed and ya know there ain't gonna be any playtime for the rest of the week.

 

Nail on the head. I've been preaching this for years with minimal success. The only time the rear brake is useful is 1) when sitting still on an incline and you want to take your hands off the bars and 2) for expert riders who use it to step out the rear when entering slow/tight turns to help the bike rotate around the corner.

 

Agreed Bubba et al. I am not terribly worried about the lack of participation nor am I some kind of speed demon. I have never been part of any team or club. What I am is a really curious person who loves learning. Particularly when it is about a hobby/pastime/sport I truly enjoy. While it is possible to learn from books and your own research/experience, I believe it extremely important to humbly learn from the voices of those with practical experience.

Some people really should buy a true sport bike go learn on the track because they just can't get over their biases or misunderstandings. I believe they would also see that many of the habits/skills learned on the track will help your street riding, but won't have direct parity with street riding. It's like when I saw the Top Gear guys test driving an F1 car. The presenter did not have the skills/confidence to drive the car fast enough for all the race technology to do its job. He couldn't even complete one full lap without losing control at really slow speeds, compared to a driver with racing experience who is willing to charge turns at triple digit speeds. Do that kind of driving with a street car (even a supercar) and you will get into trouble.

Trail braking is one of those skills that does seem to translate directly into street riding. Reading and practice are helping me learn and improve it. Hopefully this thread will help others see that people with far more experience than me are on the same page. You don't HAVE to be old to know better. You just have to know how to ask questions and understand what people say. :cheersaf:

Jose

 

About a five minute search should bring up when Keith Code's school of how to, will be in the Napa Area. Now I'm wondering if all this is applicable to vintage flat track and speedway?

 

i am no expert. I am a sport touring rider and not a racer. My theory of Trail Braking is this. Trail braking allows you to carry more speed into a corner. When done correctly the brakes should be applied at whatever point in the turn that allows you come completely off the brakes exactly at the apex. Braking should be applied strongly and smoothly early in the turn and slowly "trailed off" until they are fully released at the apex. At this point the throttle should immediately be smoothly applied for corner exit.

Braking completely before turn in is safest but it is not fastest. Braking before turn in and being slightly on the throttle from turn in until apex makes you slow from the time you release the brakes until you roll on the throttle at the apex. It is almost like "I'm done with my braking and now I'm waiting for the apex to show up". All this time the clock is ticking.

Freddy was so fast because he was a master at judging when to hit the brakes, trail off to full release at the apex and immediately get back on the throttle. I'm sure his throttle was on slightly before the brakes were fully released.

If you want to be faster in the turns, work on picking a line that allows you to complete the turn without any mid turn corrections. Practice this at any speed that makes you comfortable. Work on speed and braking later.

Smoothness is King......and Freddy was smooth!

 

I wrote an article a few years back for Motorcycle Mojo Magazine on Trailbraking and have cut and pasted it below. Hope it gives a little bit more info/insight on the topic

Trailbraking

Of all the riding skills and techniques out there, I’d say that trailbraking is one of the most misunderstood. People seem drawn to the idea of trailbraking yet they don’t fully understand what exactly “trailbraking” means, when it might be useful and how it is properly executed.

Trailbraking refers to the process of entering a turn while the front brakes are still applied and gradually and smoothly releasing them as you move through the turn and begin to get back on the gas.

Trailbraking is most often considered an advanced riding or racing technique because of the fact that it takes a lot of practice and finesse to successfully pull it off. Anytime you attempt to turn a motorcycle while simultaneously using the front brake you are testing the limits of front tire traction because there is extra weight on the front, which is only designed to handle a portion of the cornering load. Too much weight combined with too much lean angle can easily result in tucking the front and lowsideing

Grabbing the front brakes once the bike is already into the turn is not trailbraking, it is simply mid corner braking and is one of the most common reasons for single vehicle motorcycle crashes because it suddenly transfers excess weight onto the front tire and overloads traction availability. If you must brake while mid corner (to avoid a unexpected obstacle or slow suddenly) then you should do so smoothly and firmly while at the same time standing the bike up, or countersteering it back upright.

The technique of trailbraking is usually used by road racers or track riders to allow them to brake as late as possible for a corner in order to overtake another rider or block a racing line. The rider waits until the last minute to apply the front brakes hard, dive up the inside, pass, tip in and then gradually releases the brakes as they move through the turn. Common advice is that you need to trailbrake right to the apex but I’d prefer to say that you should trailbrake until you have set your desired entry speed (regardless of where that is in the corner). The ideal scenario is always that you are off the brakes and back on the gas as soon as possible and rolling on the throttle throughout the turn.

Trailbraking can also help the bike turn a little more quickly as the extra weight up front changes the steering geometry.

Generally speaking when riding on the street you want to have most, if not all of your braking done while the bike is straight up and down before you start to tip into the corner. This is especially true if the surface is wet, cold or slippery as you want as little weight on that front tire as possible. Once you have the bike turned you want to transfer the weight off the front and onto the rear tire through good throttle control, rolling on smoothly, evenly and consistently throughout the remainder of the turn.

However, there are some riding situations where staying on the brakes a little deeper, later and farther into the turn might be beneficial. For example, “trailbraking is useful in corners where your slowest speed is somewhere past the point where you turn in,” says California Superbike School Coach Stuart Smith. “Double Apex, decreasing radius, blind turns.”

For blind entry corners, staying on the brakes deeper lets you see more of the corner before you are fully committed to it. For decreasing radius turns, (which often surprise us) trailbraking can help you slow down your entry speed if you have misjudged the corner and the amount of entry speed you thought you could carry.

Whenever you use the skill of trailbraking you should first make sure that conditions are good and dry and that your control actions are smoothly executed. As Keith Code says in Twist of the Wrist 1, “Think of the brakes as a reverse throttle.”

When done correctly trailbraking can help you make final adjustments to your entry speed and see more of the turn, but when relied upon too heavily can alter the ability to accurately judge corner speed consistently. People that rely too much on trailbraking often “charge” the turn braking too deep, late and hard and waiting too late to get back on the gas.

The purpose of braking is to accurately set your turn entry speed and you can do this by getting all of your braking done before adding any lean angle or in some cases trailing the brakes as you enter into the turn. The main thing to remember is that as you add more lean angle you must decrease the amount of front brake being used. Trailbraking is just a subset of regular braking and is really just a specialized tool for certain corners and certain situations. Just like you don’t use a hacksaw for every household job, you don’t trailbrake in every corner.

Misti Hurst

 

At times, I slam the brakes to start a skid, then I can choose any line I wish, once the brakes are released and the throttle gets pegged.

 

HA HA!!!

Thanks man, I needed that this morning!

 

The question now is will ya be riding with this dude soon?