'84 500 cam timing help

I'm at wits end here helping my neighbor put his Intcp500 back together. He has the Clymer, and I've been working on bikes for years, but this is my first V4. I'm going to point out a couple things wrong with the clymer book, hoping that rings a bell to others that have been thru this.

Pg48-49 figure 78,81. Bike I'm working on is an '84, but the timing marks match the pictures labeld '86.

Pg70-71 figure 48,50. When viewing motor as listed in text, the pictures are wrong ex/intake labels are backwards. figure 50, the exploded view of sprocket marks are different than the other view.

Pg71 para 17-18 both say 'intake' (no exh spec) so they dont match pictures

Pg73 para 29 final check. Cam sproket markings listed, dont match with what was on page before.

So here's the question, Which line/label do I use on the flywheel. I assume I leave the crank set there for timing ALL cams. And which markings need to be lined up on all the cams (for instance 1I-2E front exh, etc) Which page in the book is correct? pg 73 final check, or one of the other versions on the page before.

I've done head work on bikes before, and used Clymer books, but this one has got to be the worst I've ever seen.

Thanks for the help.

 

I hear lots of people here with that bike. Perhaps someone could scan the apprpriate pages of the Honda manual and e-mail them to you. I seem to remember those cam sprockets having more marks on them than needed as if they were interchangeable or something. Good luck.

 

That's what I was hoping.. and yes you are exactly right. The sprockets are marked on both sides, and more than one marking, as they are interchangeable for all the cams.... Which really wouldn't be an issue if the Clymer picked one route and went with it.

 

This may help: ValveTrain/Cam & Sprocket Installation - SabMagFAQ

 

unfort, that doesn't... I did find a factory 700 service manual, and your link sounds like what that 700 factory manual says. Sounds like the 700 sprockets only have one marking, which would be great, but the 500 has a few marks. but thanks for the link

 

If you know the firing order (in the manual) and you know what position the cam lobes should be in to achieve the correct firing order, you should be able to figure it out. It may just be a bit time consuming. Turn it over by hand several times to re-check your work.

 

Well my neighbor was able to sweet talk the local honda dealer into copying a couple pages from the factory service manual, which was just what the Dr ordered. The job is sooo much easier when you have accurate documents and photos. Got the motor buttoned back up last night, and seems to be running fine.

 

...and you learned a lot of cool stuff about your bike. :strong:

 

Only it isn't 'my' bike, it's my neighbors... he orginally brought it over to me because he thought it needed carbs synced... long story short, lash adjuster on #4 backed out, rocker had hammered valve, knocked out keepers, droped valve, and killed #4... after a couple months of him searching for and ordering parts, it's back together and hopefully will continue to run good for him.

 

Well, you did a good thing and hopefully your neighbor appreciates it. I've seen that same model do that same thing, and I felt guilty because I told somebody how to adjust their valves over the phone and then they brought the bike in with the missing locknut and a bent valve.

 

I'm having the same problem. (84 VF500, can't seem to get the front cams right) I got my hands on the Honda manual, but that seems messed up too. The picture on pg 9-22 shows the cams installed with the intake lobe at 11 o'clock and the exhaust at 10 o'clock (viewed from right side). If I do this, the bolt flanges are not vertical, so the cam sprocket markings can't be aligned with the cylinder face. Half of the figure is viewing the head from the right side and the other half from the left, according to the markings...

- Did you use the 2.I and 2.E marks?
- Was the crank set at TF (not TR as in the Clymer manual)?
- Were the INF and EXF stamps facing up on both cams?
- Did you align the sprocket marks looking at the left side or right side of the engine? (as I'm writing this, I realize aligning the marks on the left side is the only thing I haven't tried...)

Thanks for the help. This is driving me nuts.

 

I just went through all of this, and I had mine together wrong, due to following the Clymer "manual". The only pictures I would even consider looking at are the ones showing where the cam lobes should be pointing. The rest, I only used the text.

The ONLY timing mark on the crank you need is TR. Set it at TR while assembling everything, both heads. It does not specifically say this, nor does it say NOT to use the TF mark.

Looking at the rear head, from the left side of the bike (left, as seated on it, where your left leg would be) point the cams as they say, and on the gears use the marks that are numbered "1". I1 and E1. I1 to the front, or intake, and E1 to the rear, or exhaust.

For the front head, go to the other side of the bike, put the cams in with the lobes as shown, for the gears use marks I2 and E2. I will double check this tomorrow, as the manual is at the shop.

After assembly, rotate the engine 2 crank revolutions, and if all is good, check compression. I believe it should be in th earea of 175 psi.

Hope this helps!

 

You only need to switch from the left to right side if you are using the Clymer manual. The Honda factory manual has you stay on the left side. This in the only real difference I could find between the two manuals. If you are not careful it is easy to get confused. I recently used the Honda manual when installing the cams on my bike and cross checked with the Clymer manual and everything was fine. I was able to set cam timing on the first try. I would recommend reading through the installation procedure repeatedly until you are comfortable with it. If there is still some confusion read it again. Take your time and go slow. Check correct timing by turning the motor over by hand. As Jporter12 stated the only timing mark you need to be concerned with is the TR mark. The procedure I used said to index the TF mark and then rotate to the TR mark. I don't know the reason for this but once you are at the TR mark you're good.

-Jake

 

The only problem I had was getting my head around the picture being wrong for the front head in the Clymer's manual. Figure 50 shows the front head as viewed from the right side, and the picture has the cams labeled wrong! They have the exhaust cam to the right of the picture, and the intake on the right, which would be WRONG! For some reason, I kept seeing that, and getting mixed up! Some how, I ended up with the rear head out on both cams after I got it all together, and that caused low compression, but didn't hurt anything (thankfully!)

Maybe my copy of the manual is older (Looks like it) and newer versions have that figure corrected?

The bad thing is that I will be going through all of this again, as my chains are making noise, and I think I might try switching the tensioners out with a set I have here from another engine. I'm not sure what goes wrong with them, if they spring gets weak in them, of if the guides wear. My guides looked fine, and had a decent amount of tension, but I'm not sure how much they SHOULD have!

 

Get the parts I've bolded sorted out first...

Viewed from the right is okay. The front head as viewed from the right side of the engine will have the exhaust cam on your right and the intake cam on your left.

-Jake

 

Oops! I had it right, with how they SHOULD be, the pic has the exhaust on the left, and the intake on the right, which is wrong when viewing it from the right. I totally botched that one! The pic IS wrong in my Clymer's.

The funny thing is, they have it right on the pic right above it, the one that shows what way the lobes should be pointing!

 

I did this with a clymer and if you read the TEXT ONLY it will be correct. The pics are screwed up but the text isn't

 

I could be wrong but I think they are trying to show the timing marks in one diagram and then the lobes in the other without specifying which side you are looking at the motor from. I'd have to go back through that section of my Clymers to verify that. Either way, use the Honda manual...it's better.

-Jake

 

my number one cyclinder the adjuster backed out and dropped a keeper which dropped and bent a valve... they still carry the valves/keepers at honda.

 

((my cams were stamped INT=intake and EX=exhaust))
((I was told look from the left side of engine to do all cam adjustments))
(( use TR CAM MARKING 84-85 MODELS AND T1 FOR 86 MODEL))