Advice Needed. My RC26 is Scary Around the Corners.

Hi guys, I'm trying to figure out why this bike scares me in certain corners.

I've got about a year of riding experience under my belt so far. I've ridden a cruiser for about 4 months, then sold it for the VFR700 which I've ridden a lot in the last 9 months or so.

Now if I go around a smooth sweeping bend I have pretty high confidence and can pull some high speeds. But if the road is rough, it just feels very unsettling and I have to slow way down.

These bikes are known for good handling, right?

Could it be the stock rear shock (40K+ miles on it) which is harsh even with no preload added? (Nope, not the shock)

The stock front springs which seem too soft? (Yes, at least partly, also the soft damper rod valving. I bet emulators would help a lot also)

Maybe the small 37mm diameter forks which everyone seems to say flex under load and are weak? (Maybe? I had a fork brace which should have helped. I've got 43mm sportbike forks now and it feels really good)

My tires are stamped 2006, so they are over 6 years old and that does not inspire confidence. (Not really. I have a new 120 radial tire now which is much gripier, but my old tire felt good cornering if the road was smooth)

The slightly worn head bearings? I can feel a dead spot right in the center if the front wheel is off the ground. I adjusted the bearings so they are as tight as I can get them without feeling that dead spot at low speeds. Which means they have a tiny bit of slack in them when pointed ahead and I can feel it a little over bumps. (Nope, new head bearings did not have any effect)

I don't know, maybe it's all in my head and I should just go for it around those bumpy corners? (Nope, better to play it safe if things feel unstable)

Does anyone know what's going on here?

Keep in mind I don't have a bunch of cash to throw at the bike to fix all my doubts. Maybe $30 for new head bearings soon, but that's about it for a while.

 

Slow down................JKD
Check your tires pressure....Better yet get new set of tires and try again.

 

Definitely sounds like the suspension to me. As long as the tires don't show any signs of dry rot or cracking and then have not developed any flat spots from sitting too long in the same position they should still be ok based on my past experience with tires. Six years is past the recommended replacement period but I've ridden on tires as old or even older and never experienced anything like you describe and I push my bike and tires pretty hard. VFR suspension sucks when brand new so you can imagine how shitty they are after 20+ years.

Rollin

 

I check my tire pressures all the time. I run 30psi front and used to run 40psi rear just like Honda recommended. I tried 35 in the rear and it took the edge off, then I tried 30 and it smoothed out a little more so now I run 30 front and rear. Made no difference at all as far as the cornering feel.

I don't have the money to replace either tire although I think they are about due for replacement. I've gotten some wheelspin from the rear tire a few times, but it was easily controlled. I bet a new tire would prevent that.

On the front, I did a few controlled stops and can lock up the front wheel which is odd because I thought the back end would lift before it locked up. Is that correct or have I seen too many stunt guys doing endo's?

(BT-45's) are what I plan to get when funds become available. Along with a rear shock rebuild and revalve from Jamie D. I don't know what to do about the front end. It pops out of 2nd gear under certain circumstances so I plan to split the cases over the winter and see if grinding the dog clutches is all that's needed or not. (Engine started knocking, rod bearing damage. I swapped in a 20K mile motor and it's all good now)

 

you got old crusty tyres, think of them as donuts. They have an expiration date stamped on them! If you cant afford new donuts, and this is strictly me tawking, Go for 34# front tyre / rear tyre 36#. If you carry a pillion, inflate that rear bitch up to 40#.

Having upgraded suspension is a nice thing, analogy I think of is this; you could be eating a shitty tv dinner/garbage - but if you have a nice china plate and good silverware, it makes the whole dining experience more enjoyable! When you invest in a shock/fork springs-gold valves - it makes the entire riding experience more enjoyable. That being sed, you still have to have your steering head bearings re-placed as they are bagged out hookers. Thats a critical aspect of the rideability. Any-whoOOO-wish I could be sleeping instead of :bs: ing on this box! Gud-Luck and ride safe

 

Sounds to me like a little bit of everything you mentioned. I would just slow it down some until you can afford to get these things taken care of. Sloppy or notched steering head bearings would be my first fix though. Be careful

 

Change out your fork oil for fresh stuff, and wash out the fork internals. Progressive (brand) fork springs helped my bike alot !

Honda OEM shocks usually have gone too soft by about 30-35,000 miles, and headset bearings seldom last more than 35-40,000 miles.

At 30 psi your tires are underinflated.

 

The fork oil has been changed and filled to proper level. I added some 3/4" spacers on top of the factory spacers and it helped the front a lot.

I know that rear shock is valved wrong. When you go over a joint in the road and the next section is an inch or 2 lower, the whole back end of the bike drops out from under you and your butt goes crashing down on the seat. It really sucks. I'm thinking that the high speed rebound circuit is too restrictive.

How can 30psi for the front tire be underinflated when that's the pressure Honda recommends?

 

Honda usually recommends 36 for the front and 42 for the rear. I usually go around 34 front and 38 rear. 30 is kinda low for the street.

 

After looking at a few different places I've seen 30psi, 32psi and 36psi recommended for the front. I'm gonna try 36. Still, I know it won't effect the cornering. I've been focussing on that and I'm zeroing in on that rear shock. If your cornering swiftly and a rough road surface makes the bike drop out from under you, that's gonna spook anyone.

Just today I was in the freeway and I went over a drop in concrete sections and wow, it's freaky. All of a sudden the bike drops what feels like 3"-4". It made me get tense all of a sudden.

I also notice when turning at low speeds like onto another street, that it feels like I'm falling forward and that the bike is going to fall over. So to fix that I give it a little throttle as I'm turning and it feels way better.

 

I'm new to this forum; picked up a well maintained '86 RWB 750 several weeks back and have notice the front end never really feels planted and the rear feels like I'm riding a hard tail. Limited riding so far and the season is pretty much done now. New (end of last season) Battlax's front and back so rubber is good. I've read that sliding in progressive springs in the front coupled with a Gold Cartridge Emulator Kit and a fork brace (Telefix) is the way to go. Anyone have experience along these lines? I'm not into swapping out forks and rim up front. Haven't put much thought into the rear end yet. The bike has 42k kilometers on it and I love it. I will never sell it: it would end up on a (very large) mantle place first. Best looking bike ever made.

 

I would caution against the bt-45's my 500 had em on it when I got it and I liked them but they wore pretty fast and when the rear had about 1/2 tread left I ended up walking a long way because a tiny piece of gravel punctured it. when I say tiny, I mean about 1/2 the size or smaller than a pencil eraser. Personally I think the 45's are too thin for street use.

 

Johnny, your right about the front. The fork springs need to be firmer for sure, the 3/4" preload spacers I made for $0 really helped. I would do that or just get new springs and see how it feels before getting the emulators. There are Gold Valve units which are easily found and also some from Rikor called IAS emulators which I hear are really good, but harder to find. One of the advantages of the IAS is that they dont require fork disasembly and modification. Both cost about the same $150-$175.

Adding air pressure to the forks only seemed to hurt things, so I run zero psi in them.

I can't comment on the fork brace as my bike already has one and I've never taken it off to see what effect it makes. Everyone says there good to have, though.

Options for the rear are pretty limited due to the really short shock used on the 86's. 87's are a tad longer, but still way shorter than any newer shock.

For $150 you can send the stock shock to Jamie D for rebuild and revalve to match your weight. Reuse stock spring if possible. If it's rate is not close enough then replace the spring with a new one. I don't know spring prices, but I would estimate $50-$75. That's my plan.

For $450 Jamie D can take a later model CBR shock that is fully adjustable and have him cut it down to the proper length, revalve it to match your weight and replace the spring with a new one of the proper length. This is a very popular option.

Another choice is hunting around for an older aftermarket shock/spring like the Fox Twin Clicker. Price varies if you can find one, plus it will probably be due for a rebuild which isn't that expensive. There was another shock/spring brand besides Fox, but I can't remember the brand off hand.

Lastly, there is buying a new aftermarket shock/spring which is probably going to cost the most. $600-$900 I think, I can't really remember.

Johnny, have you played with the rear preload knob? If not, it might be set to firm. I tried lots of settings with it. Firm feels good on smooth roads, but as soon as you hit a bump, bam! Really rough riding. I set mine to full soft. It soaks up the bumps better, but the bike just doesn't feel quite as stable or planted. Full soft is the best compromise setting for me. That and underinflating the back tire. 30psi instead of 42.

 

Thanks for the info. I'll keep it in mind.

 

rear shock you kinda gona have to cough up some scratch for a new unit as the old one sux / remember though, as you apply brakes the wheel base of any motorcycle gets shorter. Bearing that in mind, when you apply front brakes; the front end compresses, and the wheel base your your scooter becomes shorter. This will behold and shorter wheelbase motorcycle which will make the bike steer quicker.

This means!: brake befor turn, compress brakes (result of braking) and turn. Short wheel base = quick turns

 

Thanks for the advice Jasonww and All. I haven't looked at any of the settings or pressures so far. Like I said I've only taken it out for a couple of runs and have made these observations. It's snowing now so she's going to get winterized this weekend. I will likely respring and brace the front during the cold months and will have to wait until it's time to ride again to see what I can dial into the back. If it still a bucking bronco then it will need a transplant. Thanks, again.

 

As was mentioned above if you have stock front springs, rear shock and steering head bearings odds are they are all shot and should be replaced.
If you plan on putting cartridge emulators in the front you want straight rate springs, not multi-rate or progressive rate springs.
A fork brace would really help you on the front also, you might want to check your swingarm to make sure there is no excessive play in the needle bearings.

 

Thanks for the insight around this. Need to do some more homework for sure. Fork brace is a given, will read up more on emulator and spring combinations. I'll be able to get the front done myself. I've read Jamie's website on options for the rear shock. $450 ain't cheap but seems like the best option due to the limitations of the stock unit. Will have to sneak that one through without my wife catching on. Again, I've very little time in the saddle since I picked the bike up at the very end of the season so playing with the settings of the rear unit might help but based on what I've read (and felt with my ass) the best thing to do to round out this sweet bike is to bite the bullet and opt for the CBR option. This bike will be in my stable for a LONG time.

 

I figured out why my bike was scary around corners. It wasn't the rear end, it was the front. I swapped the whole front end from a sport bike (43mm cartridge forks) and now corners are so much fun! I can fly through them with confidence.

The back end still rides rough, though.

I don't think it's the wheelbase change that makes the turns quick. It's the big increase in steering rake and big reduction in trail that occurs when the front end dips and the rear rises under braking. A 27* rake can turn into 24* and a 109mm trail can shrink to 92mm. That makes for a very twitchy bike.