VF500F Engine Swap/Refresh

Thought I would share what I've been working on this week...I apologize in advance for the length. I've been stewing on this for a month now...

Background: Second week of August I was planning a vacation with the family to Nags Head, NC. The plan was to meet up (I'm in Baltimore) with my Harley riding in-laws and take a few day trips up and down the OBX. Unfortunately I ended up working the weekend before so I didn't have a chance to do a fluid change and tune up myself. Instead, I dropped my 86 VF500 off at a local shop on Friday so they could give it a run through before leaving for the trip on Sunday morning.

There was absolutely no reason to think this should have been anything more than a routine service. I did a valve adjustment, fluid/filter change, new tires, etc at the beginning of the season...but Saturday morning I got The Call.

Tech said that after a fluid change he thought he heard a "funny" noise coming from the motor but that he could not identify what it was. So he left it idling on the stand while he ran off to find the weekend supervisor and when he got back, the engine had seized and would no longer turn over.

Now, I'll be the first person to admit that I am just a simple Shade Tree, but as I understand it...motors don't just seize out of the blue....and if this tech heard something funny as he said, why the hell did he leave it running!

Of course I called the tech out...but I got no play from him or his supervisor. Basically the response I got was



~ wait for it ~



"It's an old bike"

:crazy::frown:


IT'S AN OLD BIKE THAT WAS RUNNING GREAT WHEN I LEFT IT IN YOUR CARE!!


Well, I wasn't going to be around to "chat" with head service guy who wouldn't be in until Monday and I didn't want to leave the bike in their "care" while I was away, so I took the trailer out to the shop and picked up the bike.


Result: 2 weeks in OBX and NO FRAKIN BIKE!!!!

Vacation was nice, but I couldn't shake my anger/sadness about the whole thing and being in a house full of riders and having amazing weather everyday just made things that much worse.

When I got back, I called the main service dude and got the same runaround. He basically read the tech's notes to me verbatim and said "sorry".


So...I spent a day looking around at new bikes. Checked out the SV650 and the new Ninja, took a look at a Ducati and a CBR, even considered a Sportster :crazy:

Needless to say... I hated ALL of them. I just wanted my VF back. It is perfect for the city riding that I do, nobody messes with it, and I've been in love with it since I was old enough to ride.


Looked at a motor on ebay, but didn't want to pay shipping on a used motor that could not have it's mile verified. I scoured CL, but there were no 500s...


Anyway, last Friday I finally saw a post pop up on CL from a guy in Philly who was selling a 86 VF500 with 30k miles dressed in the 85 "blue" paint scheme for 1500. Included with the sale was a "parts" 85 VF with...4k original miles on the motor! Basically the guy bought it from his neighbor who had screwed up a carb rebuild and had left it sit in his garage for 15 years collecting dust :thumbsup: The CL seller basically stripped the tank and plastics and left the rest just in case.

So I offered him 1100 for both and after hemming and hawing for a few day he accepted.

Score...

So now I have a fully dressed and running bike that will get me to work and back, and a "fresh" motor to swap into my original 86 frame

This thread has pics and so is not worthless :biggrin:

Original 86 with 20k on a now blown motor:




New 86 with 30k and 85 plastics...except for the upper, which I am in search of:



Donor bike...








Anyway, here is the plan, I am going to strip my old bike down to the frame and "refresh" everything on the way back up. It would probably be easier to rebuild the parts bike, but I dont have a title for it and, I am very excited by the idea of having a very clean, nearly new VF. This wont be a total restoration, more like a refresh...with some new features like a F3 shock, full V&H exhaust, oiler kit, and hopefully a F2 wheel conversion.


Spent today breaking down my old 86 and got as far as being ready to pull the old motor. My neighbor has a soda blaster that I will get to try out on the frame and swing arm...is it weird to be excited by this prospect?







Hey, look what I found where oil should be





Looks like they blew a head gasket. I wonder if they disconnected the fan at some point and forgot to reconnect...


Well, if you made it this far...thanks for looking. Of course I am always open to suggestions on the refresh process.


First question...paint or powder coat for the frame?

 

Cool you even scored a seat cowl with that buy!
At least in the pics, the frames don't look too bad - pop in a CBR shock, get it up and running again quickly, then do the frame over the winter?
And re powder coating- as TR250 says, it's definitely more durable - just did a 929 shock in my '98 and chipped a bunch of paint off the bracket while installing it. If you're going to take the time to tear it down to bare frame, you might as well go the powdercoating route.
I'm wondering if you can talk the coaters down on price if you do all the initial blasting?

 

Looks like a great score. I have a parts bike in my yard also. Going to do a frame up resto this winter my self.
If you can get it powder coated, then by all means go that rout. I used car paint on my 250R four wheeler, and just puting it back together, I had chiped paint on it here and their.

 

Frame is off to be powder coated. Decided just to clean and polish the swing arm. Stuck with a light metallic silver, very close to factory, for the frame. Next step is to get the 4k mile motor on the bench and make a close inspection, and prep for the oiler mod.

 

the top end oiling mod is not needed on the 500's there do not have a oiling issue its the valve springs that causes problems (dropped vavles) your money would be better spent some where else.

 

Is there a long term solution to the valve spring issue?

 

better springs, from where i dont know yet i am looking for them myself..

 

So I finally got some time to tear down the old motor...the results were not pretty. Glad this happened on the stand and not on the street.

 

Looks like what happened to mine when I was racing it. Valve keeper split, allowing the valve to drop into the engine. Luckily I only ended up with a damaged head and I had a spare. The valve head ended up being jammed back into its hole upside down. Never did find any pieces of the valve stem.

 

One of the valve heads is completely gone and the other is welded into the port sideways. I haven't pulled the bottom end yet so I dont know if there is any damage to the block.

The cams, rockers and springs all look pretty good though so I am am still leaning towards human error as the root cause...

 

The source of this problem (dropped valves) is the valve springs. This has been something that has plauged the 500's since day 1. At high RPM the valves can, and do, float. The slamming back against the keeper is what breaks it. Most often the tip of the valve itself is what fractures and breaks away to the point that the keeper groove is just stripped right off the end of the stem. All of the 500's that I've seen with this problem have all been damamged in the same way.

To date the only solution has been to get new Honda springs and replace them every 20,000 miles (or each racing season). I'm working a side project that is an investigation into a new design of valve springs to fix this problem. I've got a couple of leads so hopefully when work lightens up a bit I'll get time to follow up on them.

 

That would be great. Even though I am not racing the bike, I may do some track days. Plus I am always one for improving equipment.

 

Frame is back from powder coat

OK, folks...finally picked up the frame from the powder coat this afternoon and I couldn't be happier. The color is slightly darker than the factory silver, but it has that great gentle metallic flake baked in and it looks (and feels) great.

January ToDo List:

Order new hex bolts for the cage and mounting bolts for the motor
Remove bearings from front and rear F2 wheels, send off to PC
Install CBR shock and swing arm
Install new stem bearings and forks
paint brake calipers

I also need a new set of wheel bearings front and back, plus rear sprocket and rotor before it will be back on rubber.

 

that frame looks awesome, the guy you had powder coat it did a great job!! cant wait to see this bad boy start coming together!

 

Thank you for posting the photos and congrats on the frame - nice work!

Are you working on a CBR600F2 wheel conversion for your bike?

 

Thanks...and yes on the F2 conversion. The sprocket carrier and speedo gear are with Jamie now.

 

Good deal. Sounds like a nice project - please keep us posted on your progress!

 

Lookin good....keep it up!

 

the Powder coating looks great. Can you tell me how much it cost? Did you sandblast it first or did you have them do it? did you have it done locally or did you send it out?

Thanks!

 

$200 for the frame and several misc bits like the tree clamps...