New owner, first impressions coming from a CBR.

A little over a week ago I bought a 10k mile '04 Interceptor. Prior to this I was riding an '02 F4i that I had for two years. I'm 6'1" and the F4i felt a little bit cramped for me. No local dealers have any VFRs in stock and I don't know anybody who owns one, so there was no chance for me to test ride or even sit on one. The closest dealer is a mid level dealer and they told me they only sell about 1 per year. I found a used one for sale locally, but it had a broken engine so I couldn't test ride. I took a chance and sold my F4i to get it. It took me six days and a new engine to fix it.

My first thought after riding the VFR was how well it handles, and how it feels much lighter than it is. It's just about 100 pounds heavier than the CBR, and I can feel the extra weight when sitting still, but when moving it seems much lighter than it is. I was afraid I'd bee giving up a lot in handling, but for my level of riding I think the VFR does just as well. I do find that the VFR doesn't like to straighten itself up as easily as the CBR, it requires more effort on the bars, but that could be the difference in tires too. The suspension is much softer than the CBR, which is OK with me. I do at least 50% of my riding with a passenger, and I have never been on a track.

Ergos are just what I expected, and is why I wanted the VFR. I haven't done any really long rides yet, but I can tell immediately that I will be a lot more comfortable on this bike. The stock screen seems to work well to prevent head bobble, but the wind noise is unbearable. I've tried a few different helmets and have not noticed much difference. I will definitely be trying some aftermarket screens. Earplugs are now mandatory.

I'm surprised (not disappointed) at how the V4 lacks low end torque, it really likes to be revved like an inline four. I also have a V-twin liter bike and I was expecting some more of that bottom end grunt from the V4. I'm the kind of guy that likes to lug along in a high gear at low RPM, but just like with the CBR I can learn to keep it wound up. My particular bike (with it's 2k mile '06 engine) exhibits all of the common fueling problems that I've read about. It's got the annoying surge at 4-5k RPM, a part throttle flat spot at 6-7k RPM just before VTEC becomes active, and the off-idle jerkiness that makes it difficult to navigate tight corners in first or second gear without slipping the clutch. The VTEC transition is not always noticeable other than the change in sound, yet other times it's enough to bob my head back. The flat spot around 6500 is not so noticeable if your running it through the gears quickly, but if you ease up to it slowly it falls on it's face and then WHAM!, VTEC kicks in. I really can't believe Honda let these out the door with these tuning issues. If I had test driven a new one it might be enough to make me look at something else instead. I guess the smog Nazis had something to do with it.

So my first mod was removing the O2 sensors and installing resistors in the harness. Myself being a mechanic and a tech junkie, I was hesitant to do this, but after reading and understanding why it works I'm OK with it. This completely corrected the steady state 4-5k surging, but has made the idle/off-idle transition even worse. So bad that my passenger and I will probably be bumping helmets if I'm not careful. In an effort to correct that, I blocked the PAIR valve, and while I was under the tank I disabled the airbox flapper too. These two mods had no noticeable effect other than making the idle exhaust smell excessively rich after start-up. I guess the only way to make it run right is with a Power Commander. :frown:

My F4i was so perfectly smooth through the entire RPM range, I want the same thing from the VFR. For a bike that cost almost twice as much, you'd think they (Honda) could have done a little better. The truth is it's not that bad, but it sure isn't what I would expect from Honda. I've heard people say the Power Commander is a necessity with the VTEC VFR, now I know exactly what they were talking about. Just as well I guess, I plan on doing something with the exhaust anyway.

It may sound like I'm bashing the 6th gen VFR, and I guess I am a little, but I still like it a lot and I think I'm going to stick with it for a long time. At least until the 7th gen comes out! :thumbsup:

 

I've got an 04 and it is a completely different bike with the pciii. I've done the Leo Vince slipons, pcii, o2 eliminators, GIVI windscreen, and -1/+2 sprockets. I'm like you and like to lug around in low gear and high rpm in the city so I would highly recommend to sprocket mod. I rarely have to shift gears in the city...the low end torque is incredible.

 

Did you change your ECU out as well or just the engine?

From what I have seen none of these mods work 100% as expected with everyone's bikes. Do whatever you need to do to get her sorted cause once she's runnin like you like it will be a super duper machine. I'm with ya though, I have no idea why we need to tweak after the fact to get it tuned in, Honda should have taken care of it. There is no other bike though IMO like this one, I've looked and I'll keep on looking.

 

I have always changed the sprocket ratios on all of my previous bikes. I have no need for the top speeds these things are capable of, and I like the added control at low speeds. That's probably something I'll do soon.

I did not change the computer, I'm still running the '04 computer with an '06 engine. Now you've got me wondering if the cam grinds are different for the '06+ to go with the lower VTEC point. I'll have to look into that. That may explain the big dip in power that I'm getting from about 6500-7000 RPM.

I just checked... cams and sprockets are the same for all years....

 

But the computer will hold the fuel map to go along with the VTEC transitions point changes. I know the wiring was changed as were a few key plugs with 06 and on, you may not be able to just simply swap it out though... not sure. Starting to think you should get a PCIII for sure now.

 

I think that you are giving an honest assessment on a "pieced together" version of a refined model. (not sure if refined is totally a good thing in this case)

Lots of electro tune, valving gadgetry going on with the 6th gen.
I'm no wrench much beyond fluids, pads, chains and filters so I'm sure I wouldn't walk into the same project that you did without some hired wrench backup.

I've read of some great mods and gobblin chasing stories on a few of these forums, you may want to also check out vfrd.com.

I'm also coming off a CBR, 1000 Hurricane if you remember those so I get the linear acceleration feel that you're speaking of. It was tuned to a V&H 4to1, K&N and Stage 1 jetting. The speed far out stretched it's handling for my taste but the straight line freeways were a hoot.

I have not ridden a stock 6th gen either and not sure I want to. The 04 I picked up with 11K already had the PCIII and Staintunes and loved the way it handled and rode. I have taken it bit further with suspension upgrades, K&N filters and de-snorkeled.
The sensors are still wired and I assume the stock P.C. Staintune fuel map is loaded. It's only a bit lurchy at low speeds and the Vtech transition is minimal. I'm pretty happy with it.

Hope that you are not chasing the perfect tune for too long.

 

i h8 the off idle stumble but the vfr once rolling is sweet. i put leo slips on mine and disconnected battery 30 minutes; not sure if that is supposed to help the comp, but it seem to not hesate as mush after but the sound is awesome...

 

Update:
I put another 500 miles on the VFR last week during my vacation in TN. It really is a great all around bike, but the tuning issues drove me nuts the whole time. I came home yesterday to find FedEx had delivered my PCIII. I installed it today with the map they provide for a stock bike and O2 elims. What an incredible difference! It totally smoothed out the power delivery. I still prefer the big twin in my TL1000R, but the V4 just got a little better.

 

Have we seen pics of the new ride yet?

 

I took these pics yesterday after I did the custom exhaust. I forgot to put the grab bars back on after removing the saddle bags.

 

The black out frame and forks look great on that.
Do those slipo-ons come with their own p.c. mapping?
Good Luck!

 

If those are car mufflers, there isn't a PCIII map out there that will adequately tune for them. You probably have next to no back pressure. You're only hope is to get some dyno time & custom tuning. The smallest car engines these days are 1.6l - 1.8l. That means they have pistons more than double the size of the ones in your bike & they usually only use one of those fart cans.

KC-10 FE out...
lane: :usa2:

 

I rode a 07 for the first time this weekend, and didnt see any of the issues you were talking about. I also rode an 02 and did see a huge problem ( thought I broke one of my best buddies bikes! ) cause I was pussy footin on it and crept up on the vtech wrong. Both have the Power Commander installed. I ride a gen 1 normally, so maybe I would have seen some of the probs if I was used to a cbr. But coming from a first gen, all I saw was lots of power and control. I am not disputing your claims either, just letting you know what my experiance was like. I saw lots of power on both bikes without any flat spots while riding on back roads. I will say I didnt get much cornering in, because of where we rode to and from. Only adding my 2 cents because these bikes were stock except for the power commander. Maybe it is a good solution to the probs? TOECUTTER and Toxic Shock are the owners of the two bikes I rode, TOE being a mechanic and general vfr do gooder might be able to give you some tech advice, PM him before you spend too much more $ on parts, he may have some good advice on the vtech.
Most importantly if you keep this bike stay on this forum, nothin but good people here.
And if you wind up hating the bike, I'll trade you my Jeep and my Bike for it. LOL talk about flat spots in the power curve.....

 

P.S. Beautiful black and red bike btw.

 

Thanks, I'm going to black out a few more things as well. I wish the body was black too, but it's too nice to re-paint.

Yes it will need a custom tune. I own a dyno and I will do it as soon as I can, for now I'm running one of the slip-on maps from Dynojet. They are car mufflers but the construction is no different than all the aftermarket motorcycle mufflers I've seen. You can see right through them with the baffles removed, just a perforated tube wrapped with steel wool and fiberglass. I have M4s on my TLR and also on the CBR I just sold, they are the same design. Before that I had D&D and Two Bros, can see right through them too. The inner diameter of these is a little larger at 2.5" compared to the 2" of the M4 but either way is grossly oversize for 781cc. I noticed with the baffles removed the engine braking is virtually non-existent. With the baffles in it's a little better but still not like stock. One of the things I really liked about the VFR is how well it engine brakes, now I realize it's probably just because it's the only bike I've ever owned that had stock exhaust.

 

...Check out my post #8.... I got the power commander and it has almost completely resolved all of my complaints.

 

Here are a couple pics taken last week at the Dragon. I wasn't exactly slaying, but at least I got to see what it's all about.

 

We tried having my passenger hold the back instead of me and it was HELL, I too ride a passenger often. When she holds me, all is well, as soon as she was holding the back of the bike ( like your passenger is ) it put a strain on my balance so freaking bad.... I am on a very differant bike tho, as well as being a smaller rider ( I am 5'8 and my passenger is about the same h/t w/t as me )
Glad to see you out havin fun bro, hope you stay with us interceptor riders :thumbsup:

 

Honestly, If I couldn't hear her singing I wouldn't even know she's on there except for slightly slowed response in handling. I'm 6'1" 185 and she's only about 120. I drive pretty easy when she's on, she's only grabbed my waist a few times.

 

I two up with my son and he REFUSES to hold on to daddy...except when stopping, I can't really tell he's on at all. Props to his passenger riding abilities. He goes about a buck-fifty.