inexperienced Bonehead riders

Originally it was going to be "Octopus", but the multiple reference of "Octopi" was too much trouble...

Good question!

 

I thought I'd weigh in on the MSF course since I took it 3 weeks ago and had some issues with not only how they taught the course but also in a couple people that passed that have no business riding even a moped. The course barely covered the basics and a cute blond girl passed with the max amount of points even though she failed every portion of the test with multiple foot downs and going way outside the lines on every part besides the "swerve" which was a lane change at best at low speed.

I think that the courses both msf and dmv skills test should test more than they do and that before passing them you should be required to take a "road test" much like a car. To me testing someone for 10 minutes in an open empty parking lot is rediculous to qualify someone as prepared to ride in traffic or anything over 15-20mph 2nd gear test speeds. Last time I looked it takes a lot longer and alot more skill to stop from 60-75mph than it does at 10-15mph where you can lock the back brake and skid to a nice little stop, a very common observance at safety course and completely acceptable.

 

WOW i feel much better now, im going to take the course soon and i had a bad dream the other night that i failed the class and i have been riding since i was 14 and im 46 now. plus i like cute blond girls

 

I deleted most of this for space. But Stuke. As you often have said in the past to others. Very well put. As a matter of fact extremely well put. And so far you haven't sat on the sidelines in important discussions. Don't start now. We all have points of view and we can all learn something from everyone's.

The boss is calling me for dinner otherwise I would blow a whole bunch more smoke up your arse

 

I believe in natural selection, and it seems most of the people we are talking about are lining up in the self delete line- unfortunately they are doing it in our sport. couldn't they just line up over at the russian roullete booth and not tarnish the responsible riders that make up our sport?

 

Last time I checked, this is supposed to be America. People are allowed to buy motorcycles here and learn how to ride them. Hell they can wear short and flip-flops if they want to.And your allowed to whine about it if you want to. Isn't it great. My problem with your whineing is it promotes more regulation and asholes telling all of us how where suppost to live. Ive been riding for 30 years. Have 5 bikes in the garage all different kinds including that loud Harley you speak of, and its great to ride from time to time. Have fun complaining about everyone who's not just like you and Ill continue enjoying our freedoms while we have em.

 

Speed, My biggest prayers to your daughter and family.

 

The freedoms to wear improper gear does affect others in the fact that everyones insurance goes up paying for the skin grafts and medical bills from improper gear and riders passing too easy of a course and wrecking shortly after. I believe in both freedom of choice and natural selection but these kinds of decisions impact everyone who rides, not just those who use their "freedoms" to ride around like these powerful machines are bicycles.

Just my 2 cents and I just got my license and don't even have a motorcycle yet.

 

I would have to agree with you about all the stupid inexperienced riders out there. I see them all the time, well when I am not deployed to the middle east. I think that a motocycle safety course should be mandatory in order to get a license. These type of reckless riders do two things for us responsible riders. They make the cops look at us that much closer like we have done something wrong. The second is they make our insurance price go up on all of those cool bikes that I really want. Don't get me wrong I love my VFR and would not trade it for the world but there those exotic bikes I want but can't afford the insurance. By the I will pray for your daughter.

 

I 100% totally agree with this. My boys both went to the MSF class and when they came out they thought they were experts. I had to take them out there and show that there was a lot more to learn than just turning tight figure 8s and stopping and starting at will.

When I got my VFR back in October of last year, I had not been riding for over 20 years. So I went out to the local Middle school parking lot and practices my a$$ off. I've been working on my boys in that same respect. They are 20 and 23 and I refuse to let them ride on their own yet (yes I still have some control since they both still live with me). They are whining big time to get out there on their own, but I've told them they both need 500 miles riding time with Dad (which is an education, we stop often and talk about what they did right, and sometimes wrong) along with some serious practice time at that same middle school I practiced at. The good thing with this school is that you can actually get up to about 50 mph and you can run through a couple of wide turns at 30 to 35. I think that really gets them to get the feel of the real road. The other thing that is cool with this school is that one of these turns has an island which blocks the view behind it and one of the drills I've been working on them with is coming into that turn and I've told them to expect that something may be in the corner. I then take a small soccer cone and put it is certain places and they have to avoid hitting it. I try to explain that the reason I want them to become so comfortable with the bike is when they get surprised by something (Like this cone) or perhaps do something wrong that gets them close to getting in trouble, they then will have the skills to get out of it.

Just yesterday, even with 8000 miles under my belt since October, I was riding with two4one up near Hawk mountain and managed to get myself into a sticky situation. Carried a bit to much speed into this corner and was headed towards some rocks and a bank a bit on the squirrely side. Two4one said he was cheering for me to pull it out. Luckily, I have taken corners at that speed before and was able to get the bike leaned over and slowed down enough to get thorugh the turn. It doesn't take much to get in trouble on a bike, and it helps when you have at least some level of skills to get out of sticky situations without panic.

I feel like the US needs a change in the license approach. The MSF course is a great first step, but the US states should institute a graduated motorcycle license approach like they have across the pond. You should be limited in displacement of the motorcycle until you've gotten through the multiple levels of training. You shoudln't be able to ride a 1000rr until you've had some serious training and perhaps even some track time and the track work should include some emergency maneuvers so folks know how to deal with things when they get surprised.

 

I always cringe when I see riders without gear. It's their choice, but I can't help thinking that they must not fully understand the risks they are taking. Either that, or they're really stupid. What's the third explanation?

 

I'll second all that PA!

BZ

 

While I am all for graduated licenses, it will only really be the primarily weapon against the 2 main problem groups.

Group 1, The Squids
These idiots go out & buy the flavor of the month GCXYR-12345. Mind you, they have zero experience & only picked the bike they did because their buddies told them to.

Group 2, The HOGs
These idiots feel like a motorcycle is something they need to do. Since they rode a Schwinn in grade school, that means they know how to ride. They have a life crisis of some sort so they run down to the local HD dealer & pick a color & ride off with a bike that they probably don't even know the model name of.

For the rest of the riding community, graduated licenses will be something of a nuisance. I started small & worked up but that's because I knew better. If a responsible riding wants to go straight from a Nighthawk 250 to a Ducati S4RS, a responsible rider should be able to do so. Problem is, who gets to make the determination of which rider is responsible & who is not?

KC-10 FE out...
lane: :usa2:

 

What a thread, love it.. yea they are out there, in fact all over the place. what can you do, really not much. Yea you can give em some advice in a polite manner, but really what is that going to accomplish, they'll do what they want, I'm tired of pointing out the obvious to folks that for some reason don't get it. So I'll worry about me and my loved ones.

Okay time for a thread jack, So has a date been set in stone and a location for the stukas meet and greet?

 

Hey we can make the same argument for Motorcycles Period. There are a lot of people out there that say that Motorcycles impact there medical insurance. Should we outlaw motorcycles? What the hell. I can't believe what Im seeing here. :treehugger: Im for natural selection but not for more regulation. This country is going to regulate its self to death. And oppinions like this just help it along.

 

I must say, I agree with what you're saying for the most part. We as society need to find a happy middle ground between laws & common sense. Unfortunately, common sense IS NOT common which is how laws happen to begin with.

I am just about 100% against government interference into the working of day to day life. The problem is, if the people don't regulate themselves, the government is all too happy to step up & do it for us. I don't think there should be helmet laws but it seems to me that it is a necessity since there are still people that don't wear them despite the OVERWHELMING evidence that it is a good thing to do so.

On the flip side of the coin, if we had no regulation, you would simply need to turn 16 & you would be handed a drivers license. Think of how many people you know that can't drive worth a crap & have been driving for decades.

I've said it many, many times, we as riders need to actively start mentoring our community as a whole. With gas prices being what they are, expect an explosion of new riders. When more riders are on the road, that means more public displays of stupidity & more public outcry to do something about it.

KC-10 FE out...
lane: :usa2: