Just switched the VFR over to Amsoil (MCF)synthetic...

WARNING: THIS IS AN OIL THREAD

If oil threads piss you off, go away. There...I warned you.

I recently switched my 07 VFR from the Honda GN4 10W-40 "dino" shite to Amsoil (MCF) 10W-40. The motor has 1490 miles on it and has seen one oil change prior to this one. I took the factory oil (GN4) out at 610 miles and put GN4 back in it until now.

Here are some things I've noticed about the motor 100 miles into riding it with the Amsoil:

1)The valvetrain is noticeable quieter...noticeably.
2)I had to readjust the idle speed...after the switch it was 200 RPM higher than it was originally.
3)The coolant stayed about 10 degrees cooler at highway and city speeds.

And before anyone asks...No, I'm not an Amsoil dealer. Sheesh. :wink:

 

And people thought I was making up stories... pretty cool huh?

 

Now that is good to hear. All that by a simple oil change. Gotta love those chemists huh.

 

Hmmm, I have found this all true, "but" question that your drivetrain especially the valves & tranny got quiter (even AmsOil reps will tell you you will here your engine internals more with full synthetic).

Why do you think duroblend oils on bikes & cars are populer, because you get both worlds of engine noise suppression & synthetic lubricating benifits.
By far, using 100% synthetic is better for your drivetrain, resulting in less wear & quicker revs. :tongue:


I use exclusively Synthetic Oils (AmsOils, & Mobile 1 Race synth.) & alway's noticed the motor a little noisier. reason is that things are moving smoother & better & the synthetic isn't sound suppressing as petroleum based oils is.


Also, modern metals & motors can run with synthetic from the get go.
When I buy a car, truck, bikes, & it doesn't come with synthetic oil in it, it is flushed out & changed to synthetic as soon as I get home.

 

Well, I wasn't taking decibel levels next to the motor, so I may have been the victim of my expectations influencing senses. Keep in mind, too...it was under 30 degrees when I did this outside. The oil was like syrup when I added it to the motor...and we all know a great way to "silence" valve-train noise when selling a vehicle is to put heavy weight oil in it. Just a thought.

I stand by the "less noise" assertion though...the clutch chatter has been greatly lessened (not that it was loud before, but less is less)...and shifting (even after warm-up) is much smoother.

I've heard of some people running synthetics directly after buying a vehicle. Eh, I won't...especially after seeing how these two batches of dino looked after draining it from the bike. It looked like glitter...that's how much this motor was still breaking in at 1400 miles.

All in all, I think as long as the oil is changed frequently the motor will have at least decent longevity. I just chose to go the even safer route.

I have an interesting story about dino vs synthetic. I used to make fishing weights...3,4, and 5 ounces. I'd make these as a kid for a local sporting goods store using an aluminum mold and molten lead (of course). Well, these lead weights had a hole through the center for the fishing line that I would create by placing a metal rode down the center of the mold. To facilitate removing the rod from the mold once the lead hardened, I would dip the rod in Castrol GT once every 3-4 molds. Then I got the bright idea to try Mobil One full synthetic...and the frequency of dipping changed to once every 40-50 molds.

I, personally, am not convinced a motor can break in properly running on something with this lubricating capacity.

To each their own.

 

PuCaudata
I have the same exact bike, now has ~2500 miles, and have changed once at 600 miles using the recommended Honda GN4 10W-40. At around 2000 I notice there's less vibes, smoother running, and better gas mileage. Considering the mileage at which you notice similar improvements, isn't it possible the improvements are due strictly to the bike breaking in?

 

Yes, it's entirely possible...I'd say your correct in saying that most of what I'd observed from the beginning until now is attributed mostly to normal break-in. But, right after changing the oil things changed, also.

Know what I mean?

 

I use full syn mobil 1 racing 4T oil.

I get smoother shifting
I get lower RPMs at higher speeds.
I do not have to top off the oil between changes
better mileage

I tried using regular dino oil because the local supply of mobil 1 4T dried up and shifting sucked mileage got worse and RPMs went up a few hundred at higher speeds. I found a shop that had the 4T in stock and quickly changed back to full syn and all is better now.

Now I buy it by the case +1 which is enough for two changes. Recently I found a shop that carried the Amsiol 10W40 and it is about the same price as the mobil 1 and I may try that if Im ever at a loss in the future.

 

I changed to synthetic (Amsoil 10-40) at 4,000 miles on the 2004 VFR. I have to be honest - I detected no change in the way the engine sounds/operates. I am sticking with Amsoil from here on though.

BTW, I use Amsoil in my 1984 VF750F also (35,000 miles on it). Last year I stored that bike over the winter with some fresh conventional oil - it was cheaper and all I wanted was to put clean oil in the crankcase for the winter. Well, when spring came I rode it JUST A FEW MILES with that petroleum oil in the crankcase and the clutch pushrod seal started leaking oil something fierce! I changed back to Amsoil and the seal began sealing again. I don't know if anyone else has had this experience, but I'll never switch back to petroleum oil after running synthetic.

 

You might get a lower engine idle speed by switching to synthetic (more likely on an FI bike, less likely or impossible on a carbureted bike), but no oil in the World will change the speed that your engine operates while moving/riding.

Only a gearing change (sprockets) will do that.

 

Hmmm... now you got me there.... What you say is or should be true but I swear with the PooPoo oil at 5500RMS I am running about 75-78MPH I have to go up to about 5700 RM to pull up to 80MPH.

I ride in our HOV lanes and cruse at 80MPH and on full SYN I sit at 80MHP at 5500RPMs on the dot. Maybe it is that the engine is more broken in (but I have 10K on it) or something else but I had attributed the difference in RPMS to engine not working harder.

I am willing to say Im wrong on this one. That's what is good about this place, someone always around to help you out and or keep you in check.


Here is one for you though. If oil doesn't or can't change the RPMS or how hard the engine works to produce energy or a particular speed then why do car oils contain additional friction modifiers (API Service rating Energy Conserving) to improve fuel economy? If this is true, then why wouldn't the improved lubricity of Syntehtic oil produce the same.

Also,if what you say about engine gearing is what would change RPMS at certain speeds then why would something like the weight of an additional rider increase the RPMS of an engine to reach a partincular speed or if your air cleaner is clogged you will also have to reach higher RPMs to reach a particular speed

 

BTW,

I do notice more engine noise but only at idle and only in neutral.

 

Here is a chart sowing HP diferences at set RPM ranges using diferent oils. All that was changed was Oil. This and other tests I have read all show that you can increase HP at lower RPMs mearely by changing oil. From what I have read the smaller more uniform and thinner state of the synthetic oil all come together to produce serveral good things for an engine.

1. better viscosity retention (it also leaves a good film in the cylinders that protects a bit at startup.)
2. more HP at lower RPMS
3. because it is thinner than conventional oil of the same weight, it takes longer for the bypass valve to open on the oil filter allowing to the oil to pass through filtering media longer. basically as oil pressure grows the baypass valve has to open to allow oil to pass through to the engine. Thinner more uniform Synthetic oil keeps the pressure lower longer than standard dino oil. You can get the same effect by using a thinner weight dino than called for by your mfg.
4. better shear protection
5. better heat resitance

The chart didn't translate well


Horsepower Comparison Chart

RPMS down the left side. HP across with each column being a different oil

3000 145.8 149.4 155.6 150.3 150.1 151.5 157.4 148.4 149.4 152.8 151.4
3500 180.9 193.8 197.0 190.7 200.4 205.3 202.3 196.3 197.9 207.5 190.5
4000 228.5 229.6 232.7 232.9 232.0 231.9 229.7 233.5 232.5 231.6 235.2
4500 249.4 251.3 252.9 255.5 252.1 257.2 256.3 252.1 253.5 257.5 251.9
5000 255.7 259.6 261.3 258.2 260.0 266.6 260.7 262.0 260.8 269.8 260.7
Max 256.2 263.7 261.3 260.7 260.3 231.9 260.7 263.1 261.7 270.5 265.2
@ 4900 4900 5000 4900 5000 5000 5000 4950 4950 4950 4800

 

I'm switching to Mobil 4t immediately! 260.7 hp at 5000 rpms! why mess with engine mods when all I have to do is change the oil!

 

Dude this chart was of a test using a auto engine ...... C'MON!

Next you guys are going to tell me that Car engine RPMS are different form Motorcycle RPMS. Revolutions Per Minute.

 

Yippee! FINALLY...an OIL thread!
JK.

Actually although I've seen a number of them, this is the first time I've had any interest.......

SO.

Lifespan. Does Synth last longer - time OR miles?
I think I might give this a try on my Viffer........

TIA.

 

Dude you are way uptight! Relax, man! You act like somebody is stepping on your manhood, lol! if you are looking for validation, I agree with you. You gotta take all of this stuff with a grain of salt.....oh yeah, and thanks, i've been wonderin' for a long time what rpm meant. Send me a pm. It's all good!

Ron

 

seriously? do we need to go into a physics lesson here fellas? f=ma anyone?

sorry for sounding bitter, but hope this helps! :smile:

gearing vs rpm: simply a matter of how many turns you get out of the rear wheel for every turn of the countershaft. the higher the ratio the more rpms required at a certain speed

rider weight vs rpm: force=mass x acceleration..... so the more burritos you eat, the heavier you are (or add a passenger) and your mass increases. If you want to accelerate(drag race lol) at the same rate as before you ate the burritos(or added a passenger) then your little viffer engine is going to need to make more FORCE via more rpms.

air cleaner cleanliness vs rpm: well here's the plan, stan, you can only burn so much fuel with so much oxygen(air). Reduce the amount of oxygen for combustion, and you reduce the amount of usable power from that particular cylinder firing event. So if the air filter is dirty, the airflow is decreased, and you need more engine rpm to make up for the lost power.

Sidenote1:If you guys are that worried about 1-2 ponies over oil if that...then you're worrying about the wrong stuff. driver skill will make up for that...not to mention putting the viffer on a diet.

Sidenote2: if you have a K&N filter and you're washing it before it gets dirty, you're just hurting it. It's designed to have some dirt stuck in the filter to help out with the filtration process and extend the change interval. The guidelines say something about 1/8 inch on the metal mesh over a certain portion is the time to clean it. Otherwise you're just decreasing the life of your filter and risk ruining the cotton gauze.

 

Thank you for the answers but this I understood. Those were rhetoricale questions. As far as the extra ponys. I was not looking to get extra HP through oil. I was just stating observations after the change over to mobil one. Acctually other than better wear protection, the main reason I like using it is smoother shifting.

Thanks again for the interest and the post. It was helpful. And How did you know about all the extra Burritos?

 

context is easily misinterpreted online. my bad :smile: The burritos were a lucky guess I suppose.