Corporate Honda

Powerslave and Mello Dude's comments from the Linked Brake thread got me trying to think like Corporate Honda and what it should do to revive the slumping VFR sales, in the business world, it will always come down to sales and what would make the bike sell more.

So my opinion is with the success in sales of the inline's & V-twins, I cant imagine why a ergo friendly VFR with CBR/Ducati like performance wouldn't sell. Most of my friends and a big percentage of American riders ride bikes with track type ergo's and always complain on a 250-400 mile day. I know V4 would cost about a bit more than an inline but it sure hasn't slowed down the twin Ducati's sales, I think if they don't take a chance or do something soon, I fear the days of are beloved VFR might be coming to a end

 

You would think that a bike with SS capabilities,and liveable ergos would be more sucessful on the slaes floor.
I would love to see a new,sharper,VFR retaining the ergos we all love.
What the hell is going on at Honda? No change to the VFR since 2002 and nothing in sight for the future???
I hate to agree with you R.W. but it seems like Honda just wants this bike to die with a whimper...

 

There is ONLY one reason why the VFR's don't sell well in the USofA.

Somewhere along the way, the American sportbike rider got convinced that the bike mostest HP is the bestest. Until the entire American sportbike riding public changes tunes, the VFR will NEVER sell well in the US.

Take a trip across the pond to the UK & the VFR is in the running for best selling >750CC bike every year. It's also a strong seller in Europe. Why is it the places with the HIGHER speed limits prefer bikes with LOWER HP #'s? Simple, these people know what anyone with half a brain can figure out.
1) Sometimes enough is just that, enough.
2) It's more fun to ride a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow.
3) Only a tool needs to have the fastest, bestest, most powerfulest bike on the planet every year.

Me? I'm keeping my 5th Gen. I don't want or need a bike to replace it. In fact, I want another 5th Gen so the Wife can have one too.

KC-10 FE out...
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One thing I forgot to mention. I am upset at Honda Powersports for not answering any of the 3 letters I've written in the recent past. It seems to me that they don't care about my business anymore. If that's what they want, I'm sure there are any number of companies that are willing to take my money.

KC-10 FE out...
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That's how I'm feeling about my future bike once mine's on its last legs. However, what are the chances that I'll find a low-mileage 5th gen VFR in 5-6 years? Will there even be enough parts/engines available to just replace the engine on my VFR?

I've been hearing some good things about Aprilia and Triumph with their sport-touring models. I'm even intriqued with my buddy's Suzuki SV1000S. Only time will tell what bikes are viable in 5 years.

This reminds me of how the Honda had the CRX, a totally awesome cager that feels like a go-kart with 40 mpg! They had a great run but they just stopped making them. If they kept making them I'd have one instead of my boring Nissan Sentra. I think the growing demand in SUVs killed off the CRX. What a bummer I loved that car!

 

With the price of fuel these days, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see the CRX type car come back to your market. You now can get a Smart Car down there in the US. They have been available here in Canada for a number of years now.

The rest of you, do I hear a weakening of loyalty to our beloved VFR . . I may be out of line here as my present VFR is my first bike so I don't have anything to compare it to but I gotta tell you I love it.:blah:

 

Not at all, it's just that (if I may be so bold as to speak for others) we are sick of Honda not giving a sh$t about one of the most loyal group of owners on 2 wheels. There's only so much you can put up with before you say "Piss off & I'm taking my business & money elsewhere."

KC-10 FE out...
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Well said...very well said, indeed.

 

A few thoughts...

The 6th gen is nearing the end of its life cycle... and it's clear that the engine will change notably for 7th gen. Rumour mill has it that it'll be a litre V... although a few have suggested a V5, that'll likely remain for MotoGP and it'll be another V4.

The VTEC was introduced to challenge emissions and noise laws, but it's clear (from the new CBR600RR and CBR1000RR) that there are ways around everything. Although I've to say that when it comes to VTEC, in many cases the argument is never really about pro/con VTEC, but between those who believe that the machine should cater to them, and those who enjoy adapting to the machine. In other words the "it doesn't behave like a previous bike I had" people and the "let's see what I can make this thing do..." people.

The VFR sells pretty well... but it's really a quirky bike. It doesn't have the same image as Triumph, BMW, Ducati have established for their offerings in this class. I'd bet that the next VFR/RVF is likely to add to the quirkiness rather than remove from it. Besides, marketing for bikes is near impossible these days... governments trying to ban the products, Honda's commitment to safety and social responsibility... all mean that the salesperson and riders are Honda's best marketing tools.

But what's clear is that the VFR is a very well respected bike. However, threads like one do show that everyone is eager to see what Honda will do for the next generation.

And as for those 5th genners who scoff at the 6th gen... if you expected the 6th gen to be the same thing as the 5th gen, it's like expecting your favourite music artist to release the same album over and over. Things change. People want to try new things. Will the next gen be what you expect? Probably not because we don't look at things like they do at Honda - the challenges they have and that they're trying to overcome.

If you're nostalgic, stay with cruisers... Honda will keep innovating with the VFR, pushing limits and raising eyebrows.

In any case, I find the negativity unfortunate. If you're enjoying what you have, enjoy it! If you don't, explore! Life's too short.

 

If it's a liter V-4, I will then own two motorcycles. :biggrin:

 

It's not that I scoff at the 6th Gen, it's just that Honda did nothing revolutionary or did anything to push the envelope. There is NOTHING on the 6th that can be considered an improvement on the 5th. That's right, I said it, nothing. The only thing the 6th has on the 5th would be the availability of factory hard bags. Since there are any # of aftermarket hard bags available for the 5th, it's not any real advantage. The VTEC had potential but in reality did nothing but remove the gear driven cams & lower power output. What's revolutionary about lowering HP, gaining weight & worse handling?

KC-10 FE out...
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Well, I would have said quite the opposite. Hence why I own what I own. We can all speculate till the cows come home about the future of the VFR and where Honda is going with it. If we are going to come to hypotheses about the future with our predisposed notions of what "we" think a VFR should be then don't expect a solution, cause were all different. I think they have done good, however it is time for a change. And changing involves a whole lot of R&D... that isn't easily justified on a bike that doesn't fit into a high sales volume category.

 

Along with your local Costco, Best Buy and Super Mall, this statement could not be more true. Its all about the mostest in this country.

 

What's the matter with buying a bike because you like the overall character of the machine? Who cares if it's the fastest thing around if every time you get into the throttle a little it annoys you?

When I was thinking about buying a sport-bike, I was bouncing ideas off of my friends (who are also riders). First, I was considering the CBR600RR. They told me everyone has one and they're uncomfortable for cross-country trips. Then, I considered the R6...same response for that as well. I even considered (I'm so glad I didn't do this) one of the liter bikes just to get away from the commonality of 600cc sport-bikes. Then, I came across a Youtube video of somebody riding a VFR...and I heard that unique thrum of the V-4. I started doing research into the model...specs, performance, mods, etc. I quickly found out it was one of the "slower", more expensive models of sport-bike one could buy. Did I think twice...not for a second.

I like to pick on Harley-Davidson riders for buying something on history and nostalgia alone. But, I can see their point. To me, there is more to buying something you enjoy so much other than just pure specs. Now, we all bought a version of the VFR knowing well that we could've gotten quicker, more powerful bikes. As VFR riders, we understood that the fastest option out there may not have been for us.

So, it strikes me as odd that some of the arguments on this thread denigrate the 6th generation bikes because the VTEC wasn't "revolutionary" enough or because the VTEC didn't live up to its potential. I don't get it...it's a unique bike. Like we've been saying, it doesn't have to exceed all of the other bikes...even the 5th generation ones.

 

You miss my point. It has nothing to do with the 6th Gen being a good or bad bike. It is good bike, indeed one of the best on the market. It's just that Honda took a step backward instead of a leap forward. The 5th Gen is quite simply a better machine. One can argue that point until the cows come home but facts are facts. So, keeping with the theme of ever improving a product, lets examine the situation.

The 5th makes slightly more HP (maybe 1-1.5 hp) with a better powerband. The advertised specs may say one thing but talk to any Honda Tech & everyone of them say the 5th makes more power. The one & only time mine was on a dyno, it made 104.6 with a TBR slip on & a K&N.

The 5th is lighter.

The 5th handles better.

The 5th tours just as good as the 6th (it could be argued the 6th tours better than the 5th but the 5th has more underseat room & I can buy Givi bags for $650-$750 as opposed to $900 for the OEM 6th Gen bags)

The 5th gets significantly better MPG. If I get less than 40MPG, I'm surprised. I averaged almost 44MPG for the year of 2007. My best ever was 49.6MPG.

So, someone clue me in, what does the 6th do better than the 5th? I can't think of anything, can you? I'm not trying to be confrontational, I'm simply analyzing the situation logically instead of emotionally.

KC-10 FE out...
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You seem to have missed my point as well. I'm saying who cares if they didn't take this so-called leap you expected in making the 6th generation. The bike changed...what's the problem with that. I'm not saying the 6th generation is more powerful, or faster, or better handling, or anything more than the 5th. I'm saying you like the bike you bought for your reasons...us 6th generation folks like the bike we bought for ours. Can we leave the point at that or is this one of those oneupmanship parties where somebody has to be "right"? Really, reexamine your statements and you'll see what I mean...any VFR is awesome and enjoyable. The point that one MUST be better than the others is kind of childish (it's akin to the my-dad-can-beat-up-your-dad argument).

Additionally, I'm guessing most of us ride the same bike with totally different expectations. That means someone is not going to be satisfied with the "direction" Honda took with whatever generation. Arguing this point further is asinine.

One more thing...I AM trying to be confrontational, because I like discussing things directly and I will never apologize for that. If I sound like I'm trying to speak strongly towards someone on this forum, it's simply not so...I don't care enough about people discussing toys...yes, toys on this forum to the point of getting upset. I'm here to have fun discussing the most exhilarating thing I've ever owned. Having said that, emotional arguments are easy to spot...they're the ones in which someone insists that what they have/do/support is the absolute best offered in the genre of discussion. "Black and white" arguments kill knowledge and start wars.eace:

 

I think one of the biggest problems with the VFR is Honda doesn't know how to present this bike to Americans (particularly the United States, since Canadians are technically 'Americans' too). If it's called a Sport Tourer all anyone hears is Tourer and they think it's underpowered and overweight and "hey, where are the saddlebags?" Now they call is sport, yet not one motorcycle magazine would put it in a 750 Sport shootout since it would get spanked on the race course while crushing on the real roadways and daily commuting.

I picked the VFR because it is right in betwen the two catagories. I want something I can ride all day and then do it all again tomorrow without that morning between regret/pain. But at the same time I wanted the look and handling of a sportbike. I think the VFR does both. Honda of America just doesn't know how to get Americans to understand the unique character that is this bike.

 

Gees, Rick, don't you feel bad for starting this thread ? yo KC, I feel what your saying, agree on 90% as I too haven't heard back from Mr. Honda. I'm happy with what I have, works for me, just would like this version taken to another level. Such a great bike, Has such much more to give too. yet Honda doesn't see it in the market we jet setters do. Funny thou, you see very little in the way of left over VFRs at the dealers anywhere, so they're selling. I also agree with Pucaudata, on the discussion part, always a good topic matter what Honda is doing or not. But Puc, have you rode a 4th or 5th generation? Just curious, as you may be missing more than you know. Yours works for you, I get it, your happy with it, Cool I say, it's not about saying a 6th ,5th or 4th is better or not as it is a personal opinion, but unless you've tried the others, there's no way you know where we are coming from. And as far as the 5th being better? the jury is still way out.

 

There's a RWB 07 in the local dealer that I offered him $9000 for. The dealer accepted the offer & I said I would think about it. Before anyone gets mixed signals from what I posted above, the bike would be for my wife. She likes the looks of the 6th Gen's look & we both absolutely love the RWB paint job. Who knows, there may be a 6th Gen in my garage one day, but I doubt it. Maybe if that dealer will take $8500 out the door?

KC-10 FE out...
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