VFR vs. BMW F800ST

great artical in sept issue in cycle world compares F800st against viffer. the viffer came out on top but i think we all expected that:biggrin:
another great read same issue is the all new concours 14 most info yet iv seen on that new high tec machine seems kawi gone one step further than vtec to a more high tec VVT system. i guess the new bikes all going high tec

 

That was a great article.... The speeds they were able to get on the VFR were pretty good if that was with bags on!!!! The BMW is a great bike too, hopefully Honda will keep the VFR around to compete with it for a while. I just got my new Motorcyclist and there is a pretty good article about the Concours in there too. That bike makes the sport touring segment real intiresting.

 

I was wondering if you could help me since you're reading the posts right now. Have you any experience with the Honda liners for the hardcase luggage? If so, do you think they're worth it?

 

with out bags and a lite load the viffer should do 150 not that i need to go that fast. the biggest thing i thought was the weight difference viffer is a fatty by over 50lbs

 

DC: I have not ridden in hard rain long enough to tell you if the hard bags leak, but I've been more than happy for the last 4500 miles without them. If you don't have the hard bags, get them without the liners and order the liners later if you decide you want them. My wife got me the liner for my top case and for my daily commute, I've never used it. Maybe if I was touring and takeing a full load of clothes in and out of a hotel it would be helpful, otherwise I just stuff them full.

 

The extra two pistons, rods, valves, engine case etc... plus the bags and mounts are larger and heavier than the bmw's sport bags.

 

for sure a twin is lighter, i think the viffer being a little heavier might help give it that great stable feeling

 

Over in Europe one important fact you guys might be forgetting is the PRICE. The VFR is nearly $3000 more expensive than the BMW. What you have to ask yourself is do you want a bike with only half a fairing, no luggage (altho this is an option), is longer (therefore not as agile) and probably not as fuel efficient as the VFR.

What you get with the VFR is a full fairing, option for a complete luggage system, tried and tested engine (very important VFR 4cyl V4 engine = 100bhp, BMW parallel twin = 85bhp) a proper chain (instead of a belt drive as on the BMW). Both engines are fuel injected which is pretty standard these days. As for the brakes, least on euro spec models VFR comes with ABS as standard, whereas this is an option on the BMW.

One thing to remember when buying a BMW is that everything is an option, meaning ABS, luggage and anything else you care to name you pay for, and it doesn't come cheap. For me the deciding factor is the fact i've owned VFR's for years and they have bags of character, are reliable as hell and are simply FUN!! The BMW is an unknown quantity, i'm sure it's a fine motorbike, just not for me.

 

VFR + $2K US > BMW ?

That seems odd, is that due to exchange rates or what? I know in the States I did not find any BMW dealer by me in DC that would deal on price, but the Honda folks would. Is that a factor?

 

The UK on the road price for a VFR 800 is £8499
The UK on the road price for a BMW 800 is £5995

Difference of £2500 which actually is $5000 difference and not $3000 as i previously stated. Also you're right in saying that Honda dealers are more likely to haggle on price, whereas Beemer dealers won't.

 

It was an interesting article. They stated in the pros and cons that the VFR has ugly pipe plumbing? And that there is a lot of V-Tec noise at the transistion point mid 6000 range?
Being the owner of a 2007 candyred VFR, I could not disagree more on both points. The bike aesthetically is beautiful, and the VTEC transition to four valves is very smooth-I notice very little noise beyond the normal increase when any engine revs higher-but its not as bad as they describe. In fact, Motorcyclist in the 25th Anniversity article earlier this year, said ther 07 VTEC was more refined.

 

Having just test ridden a BMW F800 S last week, I think I can say fairly conclusively that against my 14 year old VFR (1993) there would be no reason to change to the BMW.

The F800 is a nice bike, and it has the upside of ABS, a good riding position and great wind management (enough airflow to keep cool but no buffeting and really smooth). I love that it has no chain maintenance with the belt - this is what got me looking at it (Honda, take note!!)

I felt that the BMW suspension was lacking in that small bumps in a corner would unsettle the bike, and it did not like trail braking into tight corners, the back end would step out a bit. Nothing scary, but the bike felt a bit "flexy" like you could bend it out of shape prety easily if you were not super smooth, but it was always benign. Brakes are grabby at light pressure and do not progress with good feel. It is a taller bike than the viffer. It also lacked excitement in the pick up, did not pull as smoothly or strongly down low as my VFR and vibrated a lot in the seat/tank juncture at midrange revs.

I got back on my 14 year old VFR and immediately noticed that the brake feel was both not as grabby at light pressure and crisper as it progressed (non-linked and no ABS though), the midrange smoother, the top end hit wayyy harder, the throttle response was better, and the handling was far more planted with better feedback.

I am not a blind VFR devotee. Nice bike but I'll look at others. In this case, no reason to replace it against the BMW.

Now the new '07 CBR600RR I tried later in the day was a different story. If only I could live with the vibration and the riding position - that is an f'ing incredible bike...brakes, handling, power....basically a lighter version of the 03 954 and I'd be surprised if it's *any* slower (!!!!)

 

cycle world test

I read the article and was glad to see they still like the VFR .Since it won the best sport touring bike every year.I know they have to come up with three things to put in the negitive colume #1"V-teck loud andannoying" Ya I just hate that rush of power. #2 "bags cost 1000 dollars ." I didn't buy the bags .But any bags worth a darn cost a grand 1400 with liners. #3 "The pipes are ugly bugly" I dont know what to say about that .I guess there is no negitive pointsto a VFR
:first:

 

Hey, I realize that you're a bit tongue in cheek, but the biggest competition that the new VFR has is the old VFR's (and the reason I have not laid down my hard earned cash on a new one). Less of the unnecessary complication (VTURD doesn't give you more power, it's just heavy, expensive, more to maintain and costs you a torque valley before it kicks in that just makes it feel like it has more power), my old bike has gear driven cams, and while I would like fuel injection and I like the idea of ABS and LBS (makes me in the minority, I know) the added few CC's of the new bikes bump it into a higher rate class with everything up to 1150cc's in BC.... and it's no faster with all that weight. Now, make the new VFR a non-vtec 1000 cc's and drop 50lbs, keep the rest, and I'll be in line.

 

I traided from a 600 ninja to the VFR for comfort. I do feel the drop in power when the V-teck kicks in but I did not get it for the power though I wish for more power ,so I think I will keep this one for long rides and daily commuting and get a used RC/51. there is no loss of power with that one.

 

VFR > BMW.

No more needs to be said.

 

Wrong ! I own 2 VFR's & the '06 Triumph so -

The VFR biggest compitition is the Triumph Sprint ST.
It has a bigger motor, same or better gas milage, more power, comes with hard side bags, just as, if not more comfortable ('07 has taller bars & windscrean so even more comfortable), Handles better as well.
It also has the ABS option that I do have & the biggest seller to me over the VFR is the ABS is "NOT" linked so it still brakes more true motorcyclish than the linked VFR.

yes this is a VFR forum, but Honda has backed off on the sport touring & sport bikes while others matched & passed them up.

If Honda would of come out with a VFR in 120HP or more with a larger displacement, lighter bike, with better brakes & suspension, I'd buy it in a heart beat, but they didn't & won't, because that would compete itself against the ST 1300.

I have Honda through my vains & I race Desert, Super-Moto, & Super Bikes on Honda's but there Sport Touring bikes Suck outside of the Goldwing.

but even I know when to jump ship on a better product, & will be racing KTM (SM) & Ducati (1098 superBike) next year if they don't get there act together soon !