group ride etiquette

Do you guys usually ride with a group, a buddy, or do you ride alone?
Sunday I went for a ride with a group It was interesting ride. we started out at 9 AM. headed out in search of some twisties within an hours rides of home. We were to meet up with one of the guys freind in Slidell, LA. We arrived at his house the only incident on the way was we missed a turn and had to ride an extra 15 min going back to get to Jerry's house. there were three guys on Cruiser bikes and Todd and I on Sport bikes. Todd is my regular riding buddy. All i Have to do is call him and he is ready to go. SO we leave Jerry with Jerry and jerry's wife with us. After she claims that "she can ride with the boys no problem" Well we reached this road we knew of LA40 nice 10-13 mile stretch of country road with some nice twisties in it. Todd and I have ridden with these guy on numerous occasions. They know that if we(Todd and I) get too far in front of them we will pull off and wait for them. Well, we reached the end of the road in Folsom, LA We stopped and waited in a minute or so they started showing up. everyone except Jerry's wife. We waited a few more minutes and Russ went back down the road to look for her. we all followed suit. We rode the all the way back to the start of the road and no Jerry's wife. he called her but she didn't answer her cell phone. we headed back up the road maybe we had missed her we were all hoping she was OK. we stopped at the other end of the road Jerry called her cell again. no answer. we were discussing what to do next and Jerry's phone rang it was his wife She had gone home she said we were driving too fast for her. We never drove over 80 mph. we were all relieved to find she was OK. Do you talk to everyone you ride with as to what they should do if they have a problem or do you assume that everyone knows what to do. It has always been understood that you should ALWAYS ride within your limits( Skills). If someone falls behind we will stop and wait no big deal. If they don't show up in a few moments we go back and look for them. You should never abandon the group without letting them know. I think this is common sense and common courtesy. I was wondering what others do. this put a damper on an otherwise beautiful day and a great ride. Todd and I plan to go back together and would like to wring out the curves on that road. it had several multiple Esses varying degrees of sharpness.

 

I would never leave a group and go home, without letting someone know.
I had a friend go home one time, and I was not happy about it. I spent 2 hours looking for him, and was afraid he had wrecked. I normally ride with 2 or 3 other riders, but occasionally 10 or 15. I avoid the larger groups when I can. The last time I rode with 100+ was on a charity ride, when my dad wrecked my beautiful 2003 ACE. Never again!

 

I've ridden with 3 other guys on a couple trips. During the second trip it was clear that I just didn't have the necessary skill to keep up with the other guys. Periodically they would pull over and wait for me to catch up and get that all important ass break. At the end of the day I told the guys to just go on ahead and don't worry about me, go have fun. We agreed on a meeting place and that one of the guys would backtrack if I didn't show up in time. This worked out really well for all of us.

The question of just abandoning the group never came up, but it seems to me that once you've agreed to ride with a group you're committed to that group at least until the next rest/fuel stop. Too fast for ya? Then slow down and ride at your own pace; no one is gonna berate a rider for being a bit slow. Well, maybe a bit of ribbing....

 

I've ridden with a bunch of people in my career and led some big rides. I don't ride with anyone but my very best friends 4 or 5 of them anymore due to stuff like this. Riding in groups of varying skill and machine usually ends up being not very much fun for anyone.

That being said I recommend setting some ground rules at the start of the ride, we had to do this due to some squids crashing and almost getting a few of us killed.

1. NEVER/EVER pass the lead rider- there is a reason they are leading whether its due to skill or the fact that they know the road.

2. NO PASSING AT ALL-- unless either dotted line or totally flat clear line of site strait with a lot of room until a turn, its not a race if the pace picks up the best riders will naturally end up in the front.

3. Everyone stops at ALL major turns/intersections--if less experience riders know that you aren't going to leave them they are less likely to ride over their heads.

4. RIDE YOUR OWN RIDE-- if you ride with more than 1 other rider it is inevitable that some folks will go ahead, ride within your limits and enjoy the day

5. 1ST RULE of a good ride--coming home in one piece.

6. NO BS--NO WHEELIES< or turning off your buddies starter switch because you think you are cute, one of our friends still has a limp and is lucky to be alive due to some dick wheelieing onto his back at 80mph.

7. HAVE FUN!

one person taking control at the beginning and actually stating these rules helps bring everyone into reality, it doesn't need to be the person leading just someone willing to show some leadership.

good luck, riding in a group can be fun, just not my thing anymore.:lever:

 

I must confess, I hate riding in groups. I like 2 bikes the best & if I must ride with a group, I don't want it to be more than 4. If I must ride in a group, these are the rules I follow.

1. Have the group democratically select a lead rider. Once the decision is made, that rider & ONLY that rider is the group leader. This means that person is ALWAYS in the front, 100% of the time. If the group selects the slowest least experienced rider, too bad. Slow down & enjoy being on 2 wheels. The leader should be wise enough to keep in mind there are riders of different skill level in the group & should pace the group accordingly. It is also the lead rider's responsibility to make sure EVERYONE knows the route & stopping locations.

2. Choose a riding order & stick to it. If you are rider #6, stay in 6th position. Make a mental note of whose in front & whose behind. If somethings amiss, you'll notice it immediately.

3. Have the slower, less experienced riders directly behind the leader. If you are the least experienced guy in the group, make sure EVERYONE in the group knows this & then make sure YOU ride within your limits. If your "friends" try to push you or push the pace, are they really your "friends"?

4. If you want to change position in the group do so only at stops & only after every rider is cool with it.

5. This is kind of a sore point but if you ride a sport bike or think Valentino Rossi can eat your dust, ride with other sport bikes. We all know a cruiser can't maintain the pace the same as a sport bike so why artificially handicap the entire group? What will eventually happen is the cruiser guy will attempt to keep up with the sport guy & someone is going to get their feelings hurt or their body hurt. Anyone whose ever rode the Blue Ridge PW knows what I'm talking about when they come up upon a pack of 73 Harely's going 28MPH.

6. When it comes time for a break, make sure the entire group knows when & where. That way if the group gets separated in traffic, everyone should show up at the described location.

7. If the group is separated by traffic, the group in front should slow the pace until the separated group catches up.

8. NEVER, EVER, EVER ride directly side by side, EVER. This is probably the single dumbest thing a group will do. Stagger the formation left & right in one lane & make sure you have at least a bike length from the rear of the bike in front of you.

9. If a rider goes missing, stop the ride at the next safe place to do so & find out what happened to that rider. Nothing makes a person feel un-wanted more than having their "friends" ditch them & dissapear.

KC-10 FE out...
lane:

 

I haven't had this problem riding w/ the guys I normally ride with....but I have had similar problem taking "new guys" on hunting trips. One in particular stands out, we were hunting a marsh area that was very easy to get turned around in. My buddy & I had hunted/scouted the area on several occasions & where familiar with the area. The new guy had never been there before, he was supposed to be an excellent shot so we set him in the most likely spot deer would be seen. The plan was we would sit for four hours then come back & get him. The four hours passed, we arrived @ the stand we dropped him @, no one was around. This is a 3-4000 arce marsh with one road going through it; not cool we tracked him for several hours( had to call into work, as I was supposed go in to work) by the occasional foot print in light snow. We got to a point we needed some hydration & food so we took a compass reading of are location & went back to the vehicles. Where we ran across our wayward hunter sleeping in the ditch next to my buddies truck. Woke him up in a not to gentle manner( 30.06 & .308 rounds fired off in the air w/i two feet of his head<in the air>). He had only sat for a little over an hour got bored & started walking around, got lost & miraculously stumbled across the trucks. He had been @ the trucks for about three hours by that time:yell: :rant: Needless to say this pin head has never been invited on a hunting trip again; if you make an arrangement any time you do something as group everybody needs to stick to the agreement for it to work out good for all involved.

 

Those 100+ bike "charity rides" are a great way to get in, or at least see a wreck. They always seem to have a variety of types of bikes and riders skill level. There is nothing like a bunch of posers on their Harley's trying to keep up with sport bikes. When they get into a city, red lights and stop signs no longer seem to matter. And it never fails, the leader will stop at a gas station with 3 gas pumps to fill up 100 bikes! I've learned if it is a good cause, show up, make a donation, then go on your merry way. Don't even think about riding with them.:ballchain:

 

Hey that's all pretty good reading, agree with 95% of it. I won't go into all my thoughts on the subject otherwise I'd be here all day. But you guys did hit the nail on the head on what I read so far.. so does this mean we here can ride in a group? since we're all on the same page?

 

Yes, she showed very bad form just heading home like that. A mature person would have ridden her pace and caught up with you guys, I wouldnt consider riding with her again, not that it should come up again.
I don't bother riding in groups anymore, I've gotten too fast for the lead riders of the sportbike groups around my area, and they like to leave at like 10:00am anyway - I like to ride at 6:30am w/ no cars and just haul ass. If I'm going to lead I may as well ride alone - what's the point? Hurry up, High Plains raceway.

 

We can all ride together, but I think we'd have since enough to break it up into a few smaller groups according to skill level and buddy groups. We all know that a group of even 50 bikes can't get gas in less than 1/2 an hour, and forget about eating unless the resturant is expecting a group that large. A group that is larger than can pass safely through a traffic light, is going to be broken up anyway, unless you want to play catch-up or wait for others to catch-up all day. It's just not much fun to do that for very long.:frusty:

 

From my view the great thing about the VFR is in not being sexy or a crotch rocket and ability in attracting competent in the most part maturer ( not old ) sensible riders ( not slow ) that are no longer immortal and have already built up some degree of road craft.

What this means is when riding with a small group of like bike's with similar handling there is usually not that much more than a cigarette's time difference by each meeting point.

Riding in larger VFR groups of upto 30 bikes usually means that they split up into maybe natural 3 groups of abilities / riders pace preference, large group rides are usually pre-planned weeks before with everyone issued with a list of key individuals names, everyones mobile number, route maps and key stopping points so everyone should understand where their turnoffs are before the ride, in our case usually an expirienced rider with a calm disposition rides at the tail of the field picking up stays.

The down side of a group ride as mentioned before is arriving at Gas stations at the same time or eating places, the upside is that due to the VFR's good easy range of 300km's and natural group splitting we arrive their in 3 waves so not that big an issue and if you pre pick the right country town as a meeting point there are usually several eating places to mop up the hords.

The few "other" manufacturer rider's usually ex-VFR owners that go on VFR rides are no problem unfortunately the times where we have joined other larger groups of dissimilar machines with newer riders it has not been fun with much chaos mixed with crashes.

The key to an enjoyable safe ride with big groups is clear pre planning and riding with the good riders on similar machines.

Smaller groups of known riders are much better for ad hock short notice rides.

 

In my situation, most of my riding group ride either cruisers or touring type bikes. I usually insist on following & tell them to ride how ever they like I'll match the pace. Though I have to admit the two guys I ride with most often can put their cruisers through their paces & @ time are able to pull ahead of me on roads I'm not familar with:redface: (usually roads that they are familiar with; one is sensible rides 10-20 over posted the other likes 90-100 all the time, he also prefers to follow when in a group but I make him lead when its just the two of us). Plus by playing sweeper you can always drop back from the group & ride aggressively until you catch back up. My other reason for opting to ride @ the tail is I can't see much out of my mirrors; its easier for them to see me than vice versa.

 

very good thread this,so just to let you know what we all get upto over this side of the pond.
I am a member of a very large,well quite large vfr club over here in the uk,we are spread all over the uk,but we have our own area meets/rideout,now before a rideout is taken out, the ride leader has a talk to all that are going out,with words like,only over take with care,keep to speed limits,have you all got a full tank,then find out if anyone in the group is new to biking,and point out that if you should want to leave the group stop on the side of the road,wave the tec down to stop and let him know what you are going to do.
Now what we do is this,we use what we call a drop off system,so the leader takes the ride out,he has,before we go, asked someone to be a T.E.C.(tail end charlie) now the tec keeps at the back at ALL times,so from the front,the guy who is leading,when he comes to a turning either left or right,the very first bike that is behind him,waits at that juntion,then every one behind knows what way to go,now when the guy who has been droped off see's the tec, he knows it's ok to follow on with the ride, as all the riders have gone through.
So if there is a problem inbetween the leader and the tec,the tec will come across it, then he would then be able to pass on anything to the leader at the next stop,like if someone has stopped to say that they are going away from the ride,some times we use 2 way radio,so that the tec can talk to the leader.
The best thing I find with this system is that they can all ride at what ever pace the rider wants to as no one will get left behind,because the tec is ALWAYS bringing up the rear, I hope you can understand what I am on about,me being English un'orl :biggrin:
but what ever you do, ride safe, take care ya'orl...Ian:smile:

 

The Pace

Sounds to me like the problem was not with the group but with the person who left's emotions. There's no logic in just leaving... I can't imagine what her husband was going through, much less everyone else looking for her.

If you haven't read Nick Ienatsch's seminal article from back in the day, 1991, on "The Pace" it fits this thread well. text here: http://www.ridehsta.com/html/safety.htm

It made sense then and now...

Leaving a group you are a part of w/o saying goodbye is rude.
Leaving a group of knuckleheads you happen to be riding near without saying goodbye might save your life.

 

I couldn't have said it better myself. I'd rather be rude than dead, but her husband should have had her in sight at all times if he thought she would have trouble in keeping up. Sounds like he was a little, no....a lot selfish. He just wanted to ride at his faster pace. To h$!! with her. So, I guess they are both at fault.:caked:

 

I can't imagine it was a nice night in that household on that evening.... She should have continued on to the first stop. I'm sure there was some frustration there and her ego was not in great shape but you're right.... He should have been looking out for her instead of just taking off and riding like she wasn't there. Thats just a courtesy you should extend to anyone you invite on a ride, especially if its your wife!!!!

 

Yep...definetly a situation where the husband should have played sweeper or TEC behind his wife. I'm going ATV'ing w/ my wife in a few weeks & am already mentally preparing myself to ride @ her pace, I'll have to lead because I know the trails. It will be interesting, but if my goal is to get her interested in the sport/hobby leaving her in the dust & riding @ my pace will not accomplish this. This is also the first step in possibly getting her on her own bike down the road.
In this case the guys wife probably thought she could run w/ the big dogs if she was keeping up when it was just the two of them riding. But we all know how we get when we have a couple of our buddies out riding, we like to push each other a little & test our limits some. Not the stuff you do when your out enjoying a ride w/ the wife or a couples ride(fall colors, scenery etc etc etc).It was bad form to just leave, unless a statement was made before leaving that if she felt she could'nt "hang" she would head back or a phone call w/ message would have done the trick too. Never a good idea to ever make any decision based on emotion alone.

 

mistake: riding his ducati slowly next to VFRs -or- ditching friends?