2002 vfr800 killing it at the track

As a MSF Coach, we are teaching newbies like yourself BASIC motorcycle skills so you hopefully survive on the street. We don't have the time of the facilities to take you to more advanced levels of riding and riding skills (which your question goes to). Start reading books on motorcycle riding and save your nickels for the next level in rider truing and enlightenment will come grasshopper!

Do that and track days will teach you more than you can possibly imagine.

BZ

 

Bubba,
I feel that I need to post an apology after reading your last two posts.

I see no fault at all in what you have said and if my post was in any way putting track days in a negative light or technically/ factually inaccurate, that wasn't my intention. You have far more experience than I on the subject.

I see that I should have or could have clarified a number of points though so I will try.

Skill is skill. Doesn't matter where or how you develop it, you become a better rider as a result of it period. Skills developed on the track, whether in a school environment or during a track day, all serve to enrich the scope of your abilities. Kind of like adding tools to your tool box. These skills can save your bacon on the street or on the track when the unexpected happens. I learned more on the track in a day than in a season of street riding but that is just my experience. It is an amazing and fun learning environment that really isn't that expensive.

On the subject of transference of skills what I should have written was that "track mode" which to me is a deliberate application of advanced riding techniques to improved your speed, belongs on the track. To go into "track mode" while out with the boys on an afternoon jaunt down the local twisties, is an invitation for disaster.

You are also correct about the crashing. The odd bike goes down but they generally get back up and soldier on with only a few scuffs. I haven't seen anyone in the B group on the ground yet. That said, I did watch a bunch of Intermediate riders go down on the first lap of the day (wet track) at the Autobahn north course. It was genuinely strange, like they had been talking smack on facebook all week and were going for a trophy on the first lap. Of course the organizers pulled everyone off and had delivered a stern warning about respect and good judgement before letting the group back on the track. They always remind the participants that there is no prize for first place here boys and girls! Only one of the five involved couldn't continue as a result of the damage to his bike.

It seems like ego is the biggest enemy when riding a motorcycle. No wait........ego is pretty much a bad thing almost everywhere. JMHO.

I humbly extend this apology to anyone who may have been misinformed by my previous posts on the topic!

Now, back the your regularly scheduled program, already in progress.

 

@squirrelman, when I said "Press-the grip of the direction you want to turn" I in fact was describing countersteering. For example, when initiating a left turn, I "press" into or press forward the left grip, thus causing the front wheel to turn ever so slightly to the right. The word "press" is simply what my instructors used to make the SLPR (or 'slipper') acronym work.

+1 for VFRW! I'm learning so much from all of you. And now I know who I can talk to when I get ready to do a track day! I just want to become a more confident rider. I don't have a need to blast the throttle. I've done that and there's very little joy in doing 140mph in a straight line. When I make a nice, smooth, confidently-leaning turn even if it's at 30mph it's so much more satisfying. Plus, going 140 on any street no matter how deserted is spooky since I never know what could jump out at me at any moment and send me flying. I'm definitely looking into taking the Intermediate Riders Course; I want to soak up all the training I can.

Bubba, are there any specific books you'd recommend I read to become a better rider?

 

One thing I haven't read yet is about a riders mental condition. Fifty percent of racing is mental. This is proven when your racing at night, in the rain with foggish conditions. You can try to run at speed scared shitless or you can run at speed very methodical. The later works very well.

Your mind has to be in the right spot in order to go fast, smooth and accurately. Prior to entering a corner your head (thinking) is at the apex, prior to the apex your head is at the exit. Close to the exit your head is at the next corner entrance. The faster you go the farther out your head has to be. Ever notice that times on the track when your working your ass off your going the slowest? Or times when you feel so comfortable and you can relax for a couple of seconds down the straight that your fastest lap times pop up.

Same bike,same person, same track, different mental state. You want to get to know the track? Then walk it! Look at every corner approach, every bump, dip what's the camber and drop off area. Look at the track surface at beginning, middle and exit of corners. Is it the same or are there worn spots. Knowing your tack surface and corner condition gives you more confidence when you hit it at race speeds. Gives you more mental piece. Gives you more time to react to current conditions around you. So on and so forth.

You want to be smooth, you want to be fast? Then you better get your head together first, because it's not going to happen until you can instantly react without thinking. Before, during or after the spot of the track your on at the time doing what it takes to become all those things. With out the mental conditioning you'll just be an average racer-rider.

 

Hi Jethro,

Road-America was my home track, Sounds like you didn't get the full RA exsperiance, with wildlife ( Deer & Turtles) crossing the tarmac, Hot & sunny on the front stetch thru 5 with scattered snow showers thru canada corner! :tongue2:

 

Thanks Jethro, you hit the ball out of the park!

Ego is the number one thing that gets track day riders. Seen it myself and also have been victimized by it too as it’s always self induced.

As track days get more popular it seems it’s like any other kind of riding; misnomers and B.S. get heaped on it and it scares riders away that should not be.

I know I wanted to learn how to ride better and gain skill I could not get being just a street rider. Track days were the obvious solution and I thank God I have been able to do them.

I’ve seen riders who have 20-30 years street experience come out and get absolutely floored at all the bad habits they have and how much they suck at riding. I had been riding for 10 years before my first track day and I remember a Control Rider asking me what I thought about the track at the end of my first day. I remember saying: “I thought I was a good rider until today…I suck!” The CR laughed his ass off and said “Welcome to the track were everyone thinks they are fast and skilled until they come out here!”

I have had street riders ask me how I can do what I can do and I tell they its training, nothing else. Learning how to hang off, carry corner speed, trail brake, that shit is not intuitive. You have to be taught how to do it.

When people bitch about the price well it is what it is, but in perspective it’s pretty cheap compared to most other kinds of training. A pilot’s license is expensive as hell, true marksman/ combat training with a firearm is not cheap, etc. I say for 125-200 bucks you actually get more than you pay for.

OK, enough soapbox…for those of you interested I just want you to have as much fun as I have and be blessed.

BZ

 

Any of the books from Nick Ianetcsh (Jethro posted a link) to Keith Code and David Hough are all really good. But reading about a specific riding skill and physically performing the skill are two different things entire. I dind't understand some of what Keith Code writes about in Twist of the Wrist II until I went to his riding school.

Its like the MSF class you went through. I can tell you all about countersteering but its not until you are on the range riding and physically do it yourself does it click in your mind and make sence.

where do you live by the way(i.e. State)?

BZ

 

Club racing or track daying it make you a better rider period!

 

Wow this thread has me really wanting to go to the track now, I find myself wanting to push myself on public roads which is not smart. I think now I will read those books and start considering my options for local tracks. I did have one question, do you need to have full leathers to go on a track or just proper gear. Being that I am 6'4'' 250 it might be difficult to get full leathers, I know that this answer might be different depending on the track.

 

The requirements for gear vary slightly between the different track day organisations. Have a look at the Sport Bike Track Time website and you will see their requirements and rules,

Sportbike Track Time - Purchase Time for Upcoming Track Days

You should also look at NESBA The North east Sport Bike Association site here,

Motorcycle Track Days | NESBA

In my experience, they will allow you to ride in quality cordura type gear if it has proper armor built in. When you start dropping a knee you will need proper leather gear with knee pucks. I would recomend that you get a really good back protector to wear under your gear.

I think you will have a lot of fun so get out there and give it a go. For me it was the most fun I had ever had with my clothes on!

 

You can get Big Boy leathers no issue. They size them up

As Jethero posted, the track day orgs list what gear you need. Some even rent leathers for 50 bucks if you dont have the coin to buy them. You can get good leathers pretty cheap if you dont care about the colors. Find out your size by looking at the sizing charts and check all the closeouts.

Me and the usual riding gang are all trying to line up the NJMP-Thunderbolt two day in September with NESBA.

Johnstown aint far brother ;-)

You can always just come out and watch for free and hang with us in the pits.

BZ

 

I live in Indiana; doesn't it say it under my avatar pic?

Apittslife, I grew up in Sheboygan so I was at RA a bunch when I was a kid! My dad would take me with him to watch some of the races there. I would totally love to do a track day there!

 

I agree with your comments regarding riding the track and the benefits. I have plenty of road experience over the years, regularly go to Deals Gap, do track days, and race. Track riding can only improve your ability to handle a motorcycle on the road competently and safely. In regards to the video, the rider was in the slow group, which about fit his pace.

 

It does say Indiana, but I am an idiot and didn't notice LOL!

Was trying to figure out if you were closer.

BZ

 

Shit, I'm still in the 'slow' group LOL!

BZ

 

I found that the "B" group with NESBA was pretty darn fast! In fact it seemed to me that they were really reluctant to bump riders up and at times the difference between the true first timers and the fastest B group riders was huge. Of course that could have been just a function of that batch of control riders. I couldn't get out of B with NESBA. I got the impression that I wasn't drinking beer with the right people, so to speak. For me the SBTT group was better but even that may have changed as it has been a few years.

So I guess the message is, if there is a message, try one organisation and if the shoe fits, wear it out. If you aren't comfortable, try a different group but don't give up. The track has something for everyone, even my kids had a blast there and keep asking when we will be going back.

Oh yes, but don't wait because the world ends in December! Lol......

 

Oh no!
I'm afraid it is too late for me, of well, better to burn out than fade away eh!