Fork Help

I am getting ready to replace my front springs and fork seals on my 95 VFR. The seals started leaking fall of last year and someone suggested that if i was going to put new seals in to go ahead and replace springs as well. I purchased a set of racetech springs and have repair manuals and am pretty good with wrench. (rebuilt half of this bike already) Before I get into this job I thought I would ask if anyone has done this before could give me any advice or tips? I would bring into shop to have done but money is very tight. lucky for me I purchased seals and springs last year when I had a few extra bucks. Any input would be awesome. Thanks in advance!!!

 

Tips: loosen the top fork caps before you remove the forks.
If you are going to take out the cartridge for cleaning also loosenthe bottom allen bolts that hold the inner cartridge in BEFORE you remove the forks from the Triple Trees. This way you wont have your nice fork tubes crushed in a vise and the pressure of the springs help the cartridge stay in place when you remove the lower bolts.

Note when loosening the bottom allen bolts to use the correct and good allen wrench as the head is not deep and they like to strip sometimes. Then its all about the drill...


There are some clips that hold the seal and bushings in that need to be removed as well.
Next time I take mine down it will have new fork bushings installed as well, might want to investigate that on yours.

150 mm of fluid level is good and recommend 5wt oil. There are some threads that give you the whole enchilada if needed

 

Springs are easy - if that was the only thing you were doing. But since you're replacing the seals, it's now a bigger job.

Assuming you are following the Shop Manual ...
If you have a workspace with a bench, vise, you can do this off the bike. Otherwise, you can get away with leaving the forks mounted in the bike, but it's messy.

The trickiest part is loosening the bolt in the bottom of the fork leg which holds the cartridge in place. You need a 6mm Allen with a long stem, flat face, and a really good T-handle - the plastic handles molded around a straight shaft will spin in the handle.

Before you remove the forks, measure the left fork from the top of the triple clamp to the top of the fork (with cap). You'll want that fork to be set in the same position when you install it.
<Bike on centerstand, some method to keep the front wheel in the air>
I advocate for a 2x6 under the centerstand to give more clearance, or a front end stand that fits into the bottom of the steering stem.

Loosen (1/2 turn) both fork caps. Remove front fairing, the calipers, wheel, fender, etc. handlebars. *Loosen* (1/2 turn) the Allen bolt in the bottom of the fork. WARNING! It's possible to strip the Allen bolt head if you don't have a tight fitting Allen wrench in the socket. Then your only choice is to drill it out - don't ask me how I know. Try to *snap* the bolt loose with a quick hard jerk.

Remove the fork from the triple clamps, remove the top cap, remove the spring and parts (note the order) and drain the fork oil. Carefully pry the outer dust seal up and away from the seat. Remove the large wave-y snap ring. Now remove the Allen bolt (with copper sealing washer) from the bottom of the fork leg, then remove the cartridge from the top of the fork.

Start sliding the fork leg off by slamming the fork leg down repeatedly until the leg separates from the tube. Slide the dust seal, washer, fork seal off the top of the fork.
Clean the fork outer, polish would be a good idea.

Pump the cartridge piston rod several times to clean out the remaining oil. Install the fork lock piece on the end of the cartridge, then install the assembly into the fork down to the bottom. Fit the fork leg onto the tube sliding it down until the upper bushing mates to the leg. To fit the bushing you'll need to use a 6" long piece of 1 1/2" PVC split in two lengthwise. Use them to tap the bushing (the fork tube) down into the fork leg until it seats. Install the bolt in the bottom and tighten to torque spec.

Coat the inside of the new seal with fresh fork oil as well as the fork tube. Carefully slide the seal over the top of the fork and down to the lower part of the fork. Again use the PVC
halves to knock the seal down and seated, then the washer, then the snap ring, the the dust seal.

Pour in half of the fork oil, pump the cartridge until the oil fills the cartridge. Fill to recommended height with the fork fully extended. Install the spring, attach the cap.

Repeat.

 

would this be the same for a gen 1 bike ??????

 

Go to Bondhus - Timesaving GorillaProof Tools for the best hex tools. They invented the "Ball driver" but don't use "Ball Drivers" on shallow hex bolts, use straight hex tools. Their T-handles are welded and dont spin. If you have any questions PM me, I'm the industrial rep for IL, WI, and NW IN.

 

Correction !!

I shouldn't try to write this stuff at 11:30 at night ...

S.

 

The process and construction would be the same, but I don't know the particulars of that era fork.

S.

 

Thank you guys very much!!!!! After looking at manual, some videos on you tube, and the advice from you it does look semi easy. Couple more questions, What about the spacers? When I bought the Racetec springs they came with their own spacers. Are the springs the same length as factory? Should I use the spacer that came with new springs? Or is there an adjustment with spacers? Thanks so much again!!! I have alot more confidence. :strong:

 

I would use the spacers that RaceTech provided - It's part of their kit design. Their instruction might include cutting the spacer(s) to <some length> but usually it's a drop in fit.
Hint: unwind the preload on the fork cap before you attempt to compress the spring and thread it into the fork - less force required to overcome the spring. And: use a socket and ratchet to push down on the fork cap then thread it in - careful not to cross-thread the cap!

S.

 

Thanks again!!! SLOVFR mentioned 150mm fluid level. The manual says 177mm. Is this an exact measurment or does it have some leeway?

 

It is an exact measurement, but whether you can tell 177 from 175 or 180, I kind of doubt.
What I can tell you is the higher the level of fluid, the smaller the airspace remains and acts as an additional compressible factor, essentially defining the point at which the fork compression gets markedly stiffer. Remember: the higher the number, the lower the fluid is from the top of the fork, the larger the airspace, the greater the travel before the air acts to increase compression.

What weight oil do they (RaceTech) recommend ?
Please use a good quality fork oil - Maxima, Torco, Motorex is good, Bel-ray is not.
(Personal experience speaking only).

S.

 

Mike - it occurred to me (24 hr 'duh' moment) that if the fork seals are leaking, it's probably a safe bet that both the fork bushings are pretty worn, depending upon the mileage.
If it's over 30K mi. you might consider replacing the 4 bushings on the forks (two each side). They're something like $8. a piece, and since you'll be in there *anyway*, and you won't want to do this again if you don't have to, you might as well do it now.

Jus' thinkin' ahead before you start.

S.

 

Thanks again Scott. I have to go back to Honda Dealership tomorro cause thay gave me the wrong bag of stuff at the cashier window.( big surprise ) They are giving me a $15.00 credit for inconvience. So I will ask them for that and a deal on bushings. Thanks alot for your help. I owe you a couple of drinks or something if I ever bump into ya!!!

 

Man how'd I miss this thread. Yep pretty much what they have said. But I'll add this to it if it's not to late. if you have an air impact that would be a nice thing to have on hand, why? sometimes more than not those bottom cap screws are some what stuck especially if this is a first. I have done the ole heave ho on a nice allen wrench by hand and what happens is it just turns the whole cartridge, to help with this, do this before you take the fork caps off or even loosen, also as noted leave them in the triples till you know you have em where you can get them out with out much trouble, back to the air impact what this does is give that quick yet sure fire way they will come lose. if there's a worry that they might not come lose, take the whole fork out before you undo anything and take it to one that can snap em lose with an air impact in a vise, last thing you want here is to have to drill em out, don't ask how I know... From there you be home free the rest is just pay attention. You will be surprised at how huge a difference this will make, makes for a whole new ride.
On the matter of fluid. I went on a split and found some Bell-ray 7wt. 5 is to light and 10 is to stiff for what I was wanting Bell ray was the only folks I found that had the stuff and I'm pretty pleased, all though it's been two years I'm pretty sure I'm going to give that fluid a swap, I might try Race techs fluid this time around just so I know, but man at it's price I'm still on the fence. If you have to play it one way or the other go 5wt. as you'll be adding better springs to the mix. I used the amount of fluid to determine whats what, not the level, to many variables in the way and I knew the amount, 412cc, so it's was a no brainier. let us know how it goes..

 

You should have instructions with the springs to state the the new spacers should be cut to allow 25 mm of preload from the top of the fork tube to the bottom of the cap when spring, spacer is installed. This is important step to have the proper sag setttings when reassembled. I recommend that the level of fluid you end up with from the top of the fork ,Compressed, to the fluid is 6" or about 152 mm. You want the same level in both shocks. Follow the directions to pour new fluid in slow then work the fork tube, then the cartridge rod. I was luck to have an extra rod to screw on top of the installed one to work the cartridge its full travel. Any question along the way just ask.

Side note: new copper washers for the bottom bolts would be best as I had a leak in mine and had to remove them and so some sanding as I didnt have new ones.

 

i also have a few questions about forks. (sorry for the mini thread jack mike)

i just got some fork sliders/lowers/legs, or whatever you want to call them, off ebay to replace mine which are pretty fugly looking. (got the replacements for $20/each!)

i want to rebuild them while im at it. at first i was just thinking about new springs. but seeing as my bike is now 16 years old and i have no idea of the maintenance history, i was wondering if i should do a complete rebuild, new spring, valves, bushings, seals, o rings, and all that. would it be worth it?

then comes the question of what springs. racetech recommends .9 kg, i was thinking of a .85 or .8 as i ride the bike almost everyday to work so i still want some comfort in it. but i also hit the twisties on the weekends. (im about 160lbs btw).

then if i get the front all nice and up to date, it would probably be best to upgrade the rear right?

 

^ Next time I go into my forks I am going to have a set of CBR f3 internals to put in it for the rebound adjustment. If you dont want to hunt a set down then you have a few options. \

Since you just got the lower legs I would do the following:
Replace the bushings, seals, new springs and fluid. If you have some spare cash to throw at it you could have it valved but not totally necessary.

just changing the oil and springs will give you a night and day difference. I would not go any less than a .90 and really recommend a .95 due to the VFR weight, not just yours. Adding 10 mm more of fluid will also help with brake dive that the stock springs and fluid level is noted for.

Once the front is done the you will REALLY want to have the rear done to compensate and for the bike to work proper. Jamie on here is very good at setting up forks and springs from what Ive heard so you might want to see if he can help you with any rebuilds and upgrades.

Everyone must also remember that installing new forks springs and shocks is only half the work! You must have proper sag and rebound settings for you bike to work properly.

 

thanks for the info. i sent jamie a pm about a rear mod.

 

^ for crying out loud Brian, ya beat me to it.. LOL yep I'd go through it all and add in another yep to nothing less than .90 spring. I will say if you're concerned about a harsh ride stick to the recommend 5wt. fork oil in the stock amount 412cc it will be firmer but not harsh. And another yep, he's also right you'll will be wanting / needing to do the rear ASAP.

 

http://www.math.uwaterloo.ca/~rblander/vfr/VFR_forks4.txt

and


http://www.vsource.org/VFR-RVF_files/BVFRforkservice.htm