Israel:

They have done that.
Gaza was placed under Palestinian rule and "self governance" a few years ago. This was an effort to stop the not-very-smart-bombs that were walking into markets, shops, nightclubs, etc and blowing themselves up.
To assist this, the wall was built and "surprise, surprise", the bombs stopped.
The hamas terrorists keep firing mortar bombs, home made rockets and missiles purchased from other sources, over the wall.
Israel has set up systems to minimise the risks from these projectiles, even to the point of using Phalanx systems (normally found on warships for self protection) modified to be able to track and destroy smaller projectiles.
But you will not hear that in the media propaganda broadcasts, only how a big bully is picking on a little guy.

If a little guy lives in the house next door to you and throws a few molotov cocktails into your yard, you would be right pissed-off about it.
The simple fact that you have given your neighbour a place to live, hasn't been brought up.

The hamas terrorists have a #1 goal of "the complete destruction of Israel".
I doubt there is a #2, or a #3 on their list of "jobs to do"...


The media is responsible for misleading the public on this affair.
"Innocent bystanders" are being killed. The fact that the terrorists are hiding in areas that they know will result in civilian deaths, is mute.
The fact that hamas then drags whatever media are available, to look at the results should come as no surprise.

Israel has uniformed troops with national insignia on that uniform, as required by the "Rules of War".
The hamas terrorists have neither yet want to be treated under the same set of rules.
At least the taliban fighters in Afghanistan will go into a village and "advise" the residents to disappear, if they are about to attack US or British troops.

 

Geopolitical prediction:

ISRAEL will declare victory and withdraw from Gaza 2 or 3 days before Obama's presidency.

Israel wants to appear cooperative and reasonable to the new admin., and this will obligate obama to help israel when they ask later.

This also will PROVE that the entire Gaza invasion was a POLITICAL war, not a military necessity ( just like BU$H's war in Iraq ) for the corrupt, underhanded Israeli politicians who wanted a war to boost their status in upcoming elections.

>>>>>>>><<<<<<<

AND please remember that israel violated several provisions of the former cease-fire agreement (from day 1) by not opening Gaza borders, adding new settlements in the West bank, and not reducing the number of oppressive West bank checkpoints!!

This somewhat justifies Hamas protests, including their 99.9% harmless rockets.

__________________

 

Your tin foil hat is WAAAY to tight....:tongue:

 

OH, really??

if you think that israel is not a brutal, aggressive, lying bunch of militarists read up on the israeli attack on the US Navy ship USS LIBERTY.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

maybe you could come up with a reasonable explanation, but NOT "mistaken identity," please.

 

"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him." --- G.K. Chesterton 1911

 

Dr. Bob sums it up best there squirrely.......LMAO..ya know I just figured it out, your VFRworld "handle" fits you to a T!..You're a squirel man alright...ROFLMAO!

 

Did my computer somehow accidently pick up an episode of The Twilight Zone? Or Outer Limits? Or maybe even Son of Chuckie? :unsure:

 

I love this forum. Where else can you argue about dino versus synthetic oils one minute, then try to solve the Palestinian/Israeli conflict the next. Ahh the power of the VFR..... But I digress.

I fully support the State of Israel. I, like many others, served in the military
(USMC hoorah!:gun3 and was deployed in Saudi and Somalia, the sandbox as its unofficially known as. I've also had the opportunity to train with and meet several people accross the world. Isreal does receive many arms from the U.S., but also manufactures its own. They have also been known to modify U.S. weaponry. However, Israel is fiercely independent and committed to survival. They are not lap dogs of the U.S. I don't like to hear people say that the U.S. controls Israel, because we don't. We are a committed ally that provides monetary and logistic support to Israel.

Hamas is a terrorist group. It is pointless to negotiate with them. When they siezed control in Southern Gaza, the world, including Israel, essentially took a wait and see approach to their rule. They managed to con the world now into believing they are a legitimate government, then the attacks on Israel came as we all knew they would. People, they are not a governing body, they are a terrorist group and they need to be destroyed. Unfortunately, as we discovered in Iraq and Somalia, terrorists will hide their operations in mosques, schools and other civilian locations. And the sad truth to war and conflict is civillains always lose.

Our problem as westerners, whether American, Canadians (shout out to our beloved nieghbors to the north) , British etc... It is hard for us to wrap our heads around what we know in our hearts to be true. That truth is that we cannot co-exist with terrorist groups or governments that support them. The reality is that all these terrorst groups must be destroyed, killed, 86'd, vetoed, etc.... It is hard to accept that fact as a Christian. I would love to believe that if we sit down and have a talk we could then all go home and play wii, but we all know that can't happen. Now before I'm called a war hawk, just know that all of these groups want you and I dead as well, and they've proven that. I don't like burying my countrymen, I doubt Israel does either.

The idea that Israel if retreats and go back to its pre-1967 borders then all will be well is absolutely stupid (Damn the 60's and flower people!!!!!!!!:hat. There is a hatred in that part of the world that transcends borders. In fact, Israel has given much of the land back that it took in the 6 Day War and Yom Kippur, to no avail. They've maintained the Golan Heights, because of the strategic value and the Gaza Strip. They've allowed Palestinian control of Gaza and still they are attacked. They have given concession after concession with hopes of peace, and they have never found it. The worst part is the US and other western nations have been the ones compelling Israel to give up the land.

Now please don't think I am saying Israel is lily white and does no wrong, it does. But perhaps, we should at the very least allow them defend themselves. Believe me when I say no one wants a war, but allow Israel the right to exist.

My peace plan is to buy everyone in the Middle East a VFR, but it has to be the same generation because we' don't want another war.

PS: Since Canada has already apologized to the world for Bryan Adams; on behalf of the United States I want to apologize to the world for Clay Aiken.

 

AS A US MILITARY type or as a US citizen this should offend you:

34 Americans butchered by israeli US -supplied fighters!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident




BTW:THERE'S nutting wrong with a sqwerl!!! They are silly... but not dumb.

 

See post #92

We don't appologise for Bryan Adams. We do regrete Celine Dion though.

 

Squirrels...bringing enemys together for the common good.

 

the only reason hamas is labeled "terrorist" is because they don't have as good PR firms as the israelis.....

....plus powerful Jewish influence on US media.

(weren't the colonial rebels who staged the "Boston tea party" terrorists???)

 

Serious, informative, cogent, correct, and humorous, too! Thanks for all of it! Great, well written piece.


But despite all that, there's nothing you can say or do to make up for Clay Aikens.

 

Way-y-y-y-y too funny! LMFAO!

 

Heres an example of good Hamas PR, see below youtube link where a Hamas TV current affairs reporter interviews 2 young Children of a suicide bomber mother and they tell him how proud they are she blew herself up killing 5 Israelis.

From youtube you can also see Hamas related Israeli hate shows aimed at Palastinian tots its frightening stuff, the UN should stop wasting our money funding Hamas TV.

Hamas TV interviews children of a palestinian suicide bomber:
YouTube - Hamas party brainwash children of a palestinian suicide bomb

 

VIDEOS??

DID u see the unarmed Palestinian father shielding his 7 year old son, both being machine-guned to death by the israeli army; ever see the european journalist shot in the head; ever seer Rachel Coury trying to protest another destruction of a Palestinian house being crushed by an israeli military bulldozer; ever see the 2 handcuffed young Palestinian youths being sledgehammered to break their bones; ever see the 12 year old kid being shot dead because he threw a stone at an israeli tank??

I DID !!

 

I'm really starting to believe you're an anti-semite there squirel.

 

squirrelman i have a idea .... you could go live in hamas that you like so much and be our VFRworld repetitive ?

sometimes its better to walk away than to set and argue with a ignorant person !!
so the mods can do there anytime

 

of the Sinai Peninsula, about 25.5 nautical miles northwest from the Egyptian city of Arish.[1]

Shortly after the attack ended, Israel informed the U.S. that its forces had attacked the Liberty in error. An Israeli inquiry by Colonel Ram Ron concluded that the attack was caused by a chain of mistakes by Israel Defense Force (IDF) personnel.[2](p.9) The IDF, in its History Report about the attack, says it asked the United States to inform them of any U.S. ships in the area but was not told of the Liberty's presence.[3](p.22) The IDF air and naval forces, respectively, misidentified the Liberty as an unknown destroyer and the Egyptian cargo ship El Quseir.[3](p.15) Supporters of Israel's explanation say that no credible motive existed for Israel to initiate a surprise attack against an important ally and the possibility of such mistakes were inherent in the tense atmosphere of the Six-Day


squirrel it isnt called friendly fire for no reasonit was an accident. I will be offended and upset if something was to come out and say differently about the incident.. but to me it look like a truely horrifick accident. Oh and wikipedia....not the best source material...it can be altered by anyone that wants to...just sayin...

Crusty
veteran of three combat zones and survivor of friendly fire

 

I have seen saddening footage from the Al Jazeera Palestinian biased Satellite News, unfortunately as horrible as the images of Palestinian dead are it is in fact a war zone of Hamas own making.

Hamas know full well the rockets effective or not will eventually cause Israel to loose patience, doing whatever it needs to in order to stamp out the groups sending the rockets over. Why cannot Hamas understand Israel cannot and will not go away and accept a peace plan that recognises Israel as a Nation and put its energies into bettering its peoples lives ?

One answer is of course the religion which promotes dying with the 100% guarantee of Heaven, even a comparatively moderate Al Jazeera lists the casualties as martyrs cheering on each rocket launched. This just type of coverage encourages Hamas to continue acting irrationally in a pointless cause bringing unnecessary pain on thier own people. :unsure: